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zeynep's profile
zeynep tufekci
zeynep tufekci
zeynep tufekci
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@zeynep

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zeynep tufekciVerified account

@zeynep

Complex systems, wicked problems. Society, technology, science and more. @UNC professor. @NYTimes columnist. My newsletter is @insight: http://www.theinsight.org 

floating in a most peculiar way
theinsight.org
Joined August 2009

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    1. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 5 Nov 2021

      California wants to replace calculus with statistics and "data science"??? I'm a fan of teaching more statistics, but learning that at a meaningful, useful level is way, way, way harder than for calculus. And no, "data science" isn't that kind of a thing. https://www.nytimes.com/2021/11/04/us/california-math-curriculum-guidelines.htm …pic.twitter.com/Wo2PVQAONC

      179 replies 161 retweets 1,312 likes
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    2. Natalie E. Dean, PhD‏Verified account @nataliexdean 5 Nov 2021
      Replying to @zeynep

      I wish I had taken a statistics course in high school. My first stats course was midway through college. I see value in moving statistics earlier.

      14 replies 10 retweets 171 likes
      zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 5 Nov 2021
      Replying to @nataliexdean

      I'm all for teaching more statistics, earlier too. I just don't see why they think it will close the achievement gap. Teaching it well isn't easy, and if you just dump plug-and-play in front of unprepared students, it doesn't do that much good.

      8:46 AM - 5 Nov 2021
      • 3 Retweets
      • 88 Likes
      • Edith Cohen Akiva FriedmanRosner Sam Pullen Bruegel deez Firinn Emma Klugman hi Dr Susan Holmes 📗💻 Bassaces
      10 replies 3 retweets 88 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Noah Haber‏ @NoahHaber 5 Nov 2021
          Replying to @zeynep @nataliexdean

          Don't (necessarily) teach statistics, teach statistical thinking. Skip the formulas, numbers, calculating p-value nonsense, etc. and replace it with generating intuition through simulations, demonstration, and conceptual discussion. We would all be so, so much better off.

          1 reply 3 retweets 23 likes
        3. Noah Haber‏ @NoahHaber 5 Nov 2021
          Replying to @NoahHaber @zeynep @nataliexdean

          Right now, we teach statistics to consumers/applyers as mini courses in how to generate stats. That's a huge waste, since very very few people actually need those skills (and a lot misapply them without more in-depth training), and it puts a lot of people off stats unnecessarily.

          2 replies 0 retweets 9 likes
        4. Show replies
        1. Susan McKibben‏ @SusanEMcKibben 5 Nov 2021
          Replying to @zeynep @nataliexdean

          Indeed. It’s not the topic that causes the achievement gap.

          0 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
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        1. Natalie E. Dean, PhD‏Verified account @nataliexdean 5 Nov 2021
          Replying to @zeynep

          Agreed. I know you are talking about something else, but this is Twitter :) and separately I am interested in the whole what to teach first debate. I think teaching stats earlier is a step in the right direction. For our big data world!

          0 replies 2 retweets 10 likes
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        1. New conversation
        2. Avi Zenilman‏ @avizvizenilman 5 Nov 2021
          Replying to @zeynep @nataliexdean

          Statistics in some ways is much easier with rudimentary calculus. My sister teaches high school biology in CA and says that the emphasis to encode statistical literacy in the science classes is much more effective than trying to teach stand-alone stats cold turkey.

          1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
        3. MWR DBM‏ @mwr_dbm 5 Nov 2021
          Replying to @avizvizenilman @zeynep @nataliexdean

          Stand alone stats need understanding of calculus. How do you minimize error? How do you maximize likelihood? And then there are Gaussian distribution functions.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. End of conversation
        1. Nancy‏ @star31787514 5 Nov 2021
          Replying to @zeynep @nataliexdean

          I could see kids being way more engaged in this than calculus.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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        2. Jackie Bavaro‏ @jackiebo 5 Nov 2021
          Replying to @zeynep @nataliexdean

          I'm surprised you think statistics is as hard to teach as calculus. Statistics seems much more concrete - eg. kids could flip coins and see what's going on. Calculus quickly gets into memorizing formulas.

          3 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 5 Nov 2021
          Replying to @jackiebo @nataliexdean

          Stats quickly gets into that, too, without much understanding.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        4. Show replies
        1. Gordon Shotwell‏ @gshotwell 5 Nov 2021
          Replying to @zeynep @nataliexdean

          I don't get why you think it's harder to teach stats than calculus. Most high school calculus is like "memorize this derivative pattern" rather than developing solid mathematical intuition.

          0 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
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