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zeynep's profile
zeynep tufekci
zeynep tufekci
zeynep tufekci
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@zeynep

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zeynep tufekciVerified account

@zeynep

Complex systems, wicked problems. Society, technology, science and more. @UNC professor. @NYTimes columnist. My newsletter is @insight: http://www.theinsight.org 

floating in a most peculiar way
theinsight.org
Joined August 2009

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    1. Aaron Richterman, MD‏ @AaronRichterman 28 Jul 2021

      Aaron Richterman, MD Retweeted Jennifer Nuzzo, DrPH

      Agreed. Waiting to see this data, including symptom profile and how the population studied was selected. When 100s of millions are vaccinated, you can find every weird pattern of breakthrough clusters based on chance alone. They are hypothesis generating, need systematic data.https://twitter.com/JenniferNuzzo/status/1420374946723860489 …

      Aaron Richterman, MD added,

      Jennifer Nuzzo, DrPHVerified account @JenniferNuzzo
      We've known that vaccinated people can get the virus and can spread the virus. But previously (and, still, I'd argue) had good data that vaccinated people are much less likely to spread the virus. Without seeing the data CDC referenced, it's hard to tell if anything has changed https://twitter.com/j_g_allen/status/1420374152847007744 …
      6 replies 31 retweets 145 likes
      Show this thread
    2. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 28 Jul 2021
      Replying to @AaronRichterman

      We definitely need clear communication. This is so confusing.

      2 replies 1 retweet 25 likes
    3. Aaron Richterman, MD‏ @AaronRichterman 28 Jul 2021
      Replying to @zeynep

      A simultaneous mmwr would have been very helpful to understand what we are even talking about

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    4. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 28 Jul 2021
      Replying to @AaronRichterman

      Yeah. I haven't been able to make sense of it, hoping for some clarity.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    5. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 28 Jul 2021
      Replying to @zeynep @AaronRichterman

      Reverse engineering her statement: they have data showing 95% efficacy against hospitalization & deaths, and ~87.5% against symptomatic breakthrough for Delta. Which tracks with UK numbers. But the messaging about viral load/breakthrough among the vaccinated is confusing.pic.twitter.com/mH5kTDGH68

      2 replies 1 retweet 16 likes
    6. Aaron Richterman, MD‏ @AaronRichterman 28 Jul 2021
      Replying to @zeynep

      Yeah. So far only a reference to a comparative study of Indian HCW showing CT 16 vs 19 in delta vs alpha *symptomatic* breakthrough. This does not strike me as categorically different, though yes would expect *some* increase in transmissibility among this small number of pplpic.twitter.com/thVLjI1Pos

      4 replies 0 retweets 5 likes
    7. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 2 Aug 2021
      Replying to @AaronRichterman

      So read the India HCW paper. It's isn't CTs/viral loads in vaccinated vs unvaccinated HCWs—it's CTs/viral loads by variant *among* vaccinated. No doubt some Delta breakthroughs transmit but this doesn't say unvaccinated indistinguishable from vaccinated.+ https://www.researchsquare.com/article/rs-637724/v1 …pic.twitter.com/xaeDZKgOhU

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    8. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 2 Aug 2021
      Replying to @zeynep @AaronRichterman

      So are we getting that claim only from the Ptown outbreak (and since the Singapore paper showing brief period among the vaccinated with lower CT values?). I keep thinking I must be missing a crucial study somewhere?

      2 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
    9. Aaron Richterman, MD‏ @AaronRichterman 2 Aug 2021
      Replying to @zeynep

      Yes, Indian paper is vax’d (az) ancestral vs delta. Already know delta assoc w lower CT at dx in general, not surprising same true among breakthroughs. Other study is Wisconsin which has similar findings to ptown & also lacks underlying characteristicshttps://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.07.31.21261387v1 …

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    10. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 2 Aug 2021
      Replying to @AaronRichterman

      Again, I've no doubt some vaccinated Delta breakthroughs are transmitting but the Wisconsin paper has.. 17 vaccinated Delta breakthroughs total. Are these few people that got fairly ill, thus likely to get tested? What's their relationship to Delta breakthroughs in general?

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
      zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 2 Aug 2021
      Replying to @zeynep @AaronRichterman

      Seems fairly weak to hang the "vaccinated breakthroughs and unvaccinated infected individuals are indistinguishable in viral load" idea in general (though again, Delta sucks and I lean towards precaution but still wondering if that's all we got that's driving the news?)

      11:35 AM - 2 Aug 2021
      • 1 Like
      • CEO of good opinions
      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        1. Aaron Richterman, MD‏ @AaronRichterman 2 Aug 2021
          Replying to @zeynep

          Aaron Richterman, MD Retweeted Aaron Richterman, MD

          Oh yeah, totally agree. Would be shocked if breakthroughs tested in ptown and wisconsin weren't highly selected in ways that are hard to know given complete lack of other info. Singapore data more informative, but waiting for truly systematic samplinghttps://twitter.com/AaronRichterman/status/1421550490832224257?s=20 …

          Aaron Richterman, MD added,

          Aaron Richterman, MD @AaronRichterman
          The question at hand: what is the relative transmission potential of a vaccinated person who becomes infected with delta? This 👇new report from Singapore is much more informative on this question than the CT data released so far from Ptown and Wisconsin. https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.07.28.21261295v1v …
          Show this thread
          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
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