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zeynep's profile
zeynep tufekci
zeynep tufekci
zeynep tufekci
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@zeynep

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zeynep tufekciVerified account

@zeynep

Complex systems, wicked problems. Society, technology, science and more. @UNC professor. @NYTimes columnist. My newsletter is @insight: http://www.theinsight.org 

floating in a most peculiar way
theinsight.org
Joined August 2009

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    1. Thomas Levenson, Zṓiarchos‏ @TomLevenson 29 Jun 2021

      8/ Now, absolutely, the fact that the author of a highly selective essay that omits all the evidence against its speculative conclusions has a history of coming to conclusions opposite those of the research on which he depends is not proof that this story is wrong too. But...

      1 reply 2 retweets 43 likes
      Show this thread
    2. Thomas Levenson, Zṓiarchos‏ @TomLevenson 29 Jun 2021

      9/ It should evoke real caution in any editor, reporter, or pundit pursuing that same story. And here's my point (I do have one!)...

      1 reply 2 retweets 41 likes
      Show this thread
    3. Thomas Levenson, Zṓiarchos‏ @TomLevenson 29 Jun 2021

      10/ The lab-escape story depends wholly on a lot of deep and detailed knowledge across a number of domains: epidemiology, the dynamics of zoonosis, molecular biology in general and the highly subject-specific problems of lab work on any given organism...and more...

      3 replies 9 retweets 55 likes
      Show this thread
    4. Thomas Levenson, Zṓiarchos‏ @TomLevenson 29 Jun 2021

      11/ "Amateur epidemiologists" aren't qualified to have independent opinions across that spectrum. "Data guys" aren't. Philosophy Ph.D's-turned pundits aren't. Etc....

      11 replies 5 retweets 59 likes
      Show this thread
    5. xpostfactoid‏ @xpostfactoid 29 Jun 2021
      Replying to @TomLevenson

      Disagree. The politics matter. The history matters. Epidemiologists are divided. Significant number who signed March letter are rethinking. Pandemic has taught us that epidemiologists too can be wrong on fundamentals. @zeynep & @RosenthalHealth are reliable sources in my book.

      2 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
    6. Thomas Levenson, Zṓiarchos‏ @TomLevenson 29 Jun 2021
      Replying to @xpostfactoid @zeynep @RosenthalHealth

      We will agree to disagree, then. Please see this for a very compelling take down on the chain of inferences that dominate lab-escape argumentation:https://newrepublic.com/article/162689/bats-covid-19-lab-leak-theory?utm_medium=Social&utm_campaign=EB_TNR&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1624975820 …

      1 reply 2 retweets 3 likes
    7. xpostfactoid‏ @xpostfactoid 29 Jun 2021
      Replying to @TomLevenson @zeynep @RosenthalHealth

      Subhead raises a flag, though: bioengineered virus is only one lab possibility.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. Thomas Levenson, Zṓiarchos‏ @TomLevenson 29 Jun 2021
      Replying to @xpostfactoid @zeynep @RosenthalHealth

      a) subheds are not the story (and not written by the reporter). b) the story is clear: there's essentially no there there in the lab-escape, & especially in the engineered virus escape story. What frustrates me most RE @zeynep's piece is that she almost did something really good.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 29 Jun 2021
      Replying to @TomLevenson @xpostfactoid @RosenthalHealth

      May I recommend this article with extensive quotes by Ralph Baric that explains the concerns fairly clearly, and be untagged? Thanks. https://www.technologyreview.com/2021/06/29/1027290/gain-of-function-risky-bat-virus-engineering-links-america-to-wuhan/ …pic.twitter.com/z0C6kgz2IB

      2 replies 0 retweets 5 likes
    10. xpostfactoid‏ @xpostfactoid 29 Jun 2021
      Replying to @zeynep @TomLevenson @RosenthalHealth

      There is no law against using tighter lab security, however, and according to Baric, these viruses deserve it. “I would never argue that WIV1 or SHC014 should be studied at BSL-2, because they can grow in primary human cells”...

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
      zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 29 Jun 2021
      Replying to @xpostfactoid @TomLevenson @RosenthalHealth

      “Let’s face it: there are going to be unknown viruses in guano, or oral swabs, which are oftentimes pooled. And if you’re attempting to culture a virus, you’re going to have novel strains being dropped onto culture cells,” Baric says. “Some will grow. You could get recombinants..

      10:33 AM - 29 Jun 2021
      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 29 Jun 2021
          Replying to @zeynep @xpostfactoid and

          ..that are unique. And if that was being done at BSL-2, then there are questions you want to ask.” Clear. Level-headed. Responsible.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Thomas Levenson, Zṓiarchos‏ @TomLevenson 29 Jun 2021
          Replying to @zeynep @xpostfactoid @RosenthalHealth

          Sure there are questions. But no where do you or others "just asking questions" in support of a lab-escape scenario do a rigorous comparison with the zoonotic alternative–which, as is usually noted in passing, is still seen as more likely by those qualified to have an opinion.

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        4. End of conversation
        1. New conversation
        2. Thomas Levenson, Zṓiarchos‏ @TomLevenson 29 Jun 2021
          Replying to @zeynep @xpostfactoid @RosenthalHealth

          And your or Baric's point is? I keep noticing how this case is being made by chains of inferences based on what-ifs. This is more of the same.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        3. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 29 Jun 2021
          Replying to @TomLevenson @xpostfactoid @RosenthalHealth

          Our point? Up to you to dismiss issues raised Dr. Baric—one of the most eminent bat coronavirus specialists in the world and a frequent collaborator of WIV as "what-ifs" you don't think are crucial. I'm comfortable about having raised the same issues myself before.

          1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
        4. Show replies

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