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zeynep tufekci
zeynep tufekci
zeynep tufekci
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zeynep tufekciVerified account

@zeynep

Complex systems, wicked problems. Society, technology, science and more. @UNC professor. @NYTimes columnist. My newsletter is @insight: http://www.theinsight.org 

floating in a most peculiar way
theinsight.org
Joined August 2009

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    zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 23 Apr 2021

    zeynep tufekci Retweeted CNBC

    Before this gets out of hand. "Distance doesn't matter" IS NOT what "it's airborne" or primarily aerosol-transmitted means or implies, and the headline is not reflecting correctly a modeling paper they are using says. Calling in @linseymarr and @jljcolorado among others.https://twitter.com/CNBC/status/1385628971086323719 …

    zeynep tufekci added,

    CNBCVerified account @CNBC
    MIT researchers say you're no safer from Covid indoors at 6 feet or 60 feet in new study challenging social distancing policies https://cnb.cx/3emvs7Q 
    2:28 PM - 23 Apr 2021
    • 702 Retweets
    • 2,339 Likes
    • Dr. President Bubbles Adam Shively Human Error zap zap tetrakis[3,5-bis(trifluoromethyl)phenyl]borate Jos Tom Wills Noël Michel Richard Marr
    56 replies 702 retweets 2,339 likes
      1. New conversation
      2. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 23 Apr 2021

        What's true is that in a "well-mixed" room (VERY IMPORTANT ASSUMPTION IN THE MODEL IN THAT PAPER BEING REPORTED ON), if you spend long enough time, distance isn't *completely* protective which IS NOT AT ALL THE same as "distance doesn't matter" or that 6 and 60 feet are the same.

        11 replies 184 retweets 1,003 likes
        Show this thread
      3. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 23 Apr 2021

        zeynep tufekci Retweeted Prof. Jose-Luis Jimenez

        Perhaps the most important misunderstanding has been assuming aerosols=long distance only. No, they do not teleport from a person to over two feet away a la "beam it over there, Scotty." Aerosols ALSO concentrate around the person and dilute with distance.https://twitter.com/jljcolorado/status/1385708443537866758 …

        zeynep tufekci added,

        Prof. Jose-Luis JimenezVerified account @jljcolorado
        Agree with @zeynep. Distance is about the most importance measure for an airborne pathogen (see diagram below from @linseymarr). The authors say it is less so with masks. But masks in the real world are mixed quality and poor fit, so air goes everywhere. Best to keep distance https://twitter.com/zeynep/status/1385707216280375298 … pic.twitter.com/M2RkWPuO4a
        11 replies 155 retweets 645 likes
        Show this thread
      4. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 23 Apr 2021

        I'd suggest that it doesn't help to jump from "distance isn't fully protective especially if you sit long enough in an enclosed space where the air keeps mixing" to headlines like "6 feet and 60 feet are the same!". Again @linseymarr and others have great work on this.

        9 replies 55 retweets 496 likes
        Show this thread
      5. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 23 Apr 2021

        zeynep tufekci Retweeted Kimberly Prather, Ph.D.

        Another from an expert.Of course aerosol concentration dilutes with distance (and very quickly outdoors for obvious reasons!) but if the space is enclosed, they can keep accumulating, and "6 feet" isn't some magic bubble—especially if you stay long enough.https://twitter.com/kprather88/status/1384162849354776579 …

        zeynep tufekci added,

        Kimberly Prather, Ph.D.Verified account @kprather88
        Replying to @tdonaghey @WHO @CDCgov
        In general, the concentration falls off as a function of distance. However, this can get complicated by the fact that aerosols don't fall to the ground but instead can build up over time in poorly ventilated indoor spaces.
        6 replies 83 retweets 421 likes
        Show this thread
      6. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 23 Apr 2021

        zeynep tufekci Retweeted Dr. Alex Huffman (he/him)

        Adding. It goes without saying that I'm just a vehicle here, reflecting years of research on this topic by many scientists. I'd like that headline corrected, at a minimum, though, @RichMendezCNBC. Telling people distance doesn't matter at all isn't okay.https://twitter.com/HuffmanLabDU/status/1385722709271711745 …

        zeynep tufekci added,

        Dr. Alex Huffman (he/him) @HuffmanLabDU
        Replying to @BedrockConcept @macroliter @Stanford
        The point is that the authors numerically modeled the physical process of aerosol spread & they applied the assumption that air in a room is well-mixed. So the headline the editors picked really plays on their base assumption more than the actual results. https://twitter.com/zeynep/status/1385707216280375298 …
        9 replies 36 retweets 336 likes
        Show this thread
      7. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 23 Apr 2021

        zeynep tufekci Retweeted Linsey Marr

        And here’s another leading scientist on airborne transmission.https://twitter.com/linseymarr/status/1385751394595090436 …

        zeynep tufekci added,

        Linsey MarrVerified account @linseymarr
        Replying to @zeynep @jljcolorado
        This is a silly headline, as the model ASSUMES instantaneously and continuously well-mixed conditions, like if you blow a smoke ring, the moment it exits your mouth it immediate spreads evenly throughout the room. Under such conditions, of course distance doesn't matter!
        5 replies 33 retweets 247 likes
        Show this thread
      8. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 24 Apr 2021

        zeynep tufekci Retweeted Joseph Allen

        Leading aerosol/ventilation scientist after another has tried to get CNBC to correct the dangerously misleading headline and framing. Still no go. Distance of course matters, but isn’t 100% protective in a poorly-ventilated space over time. Shouldn’t be this hard.https://twitter.com/j_g_allen/status/1385892995233468417 …

        zeynep tufekci added,

        Joseph Allen @j_g_allen
        Replying to @zeynep @linseymarr @jljcolorado
        Debunked in one image... https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/02/26/science/reopen-schools-safety-ventilation.html … pic.twitter.com/fNHfBQ1Qgo
        5 replies 80 retweets 334 likes
        Show this thread
      9. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 24 Apr 2021

        zeynep tufekci Retweeted Linsey Marr

        See these this three tweets for more on the problem with the headline/framing that @kprather88 @linseymarr @jljcolorado @j_g_allen tried to explain among many others (out and about lost track of the many who tried).https://twitter.com/linseymarr/status/1385752349738688518 …

        zeynep tufekci added,

        Linsey MarrVerified account @linseymarr
        Replying to @CNBC
        Please fix this headline, as the model they used ASSUMES that the room is instantaneously and continuously well-mixed, like if you blow a smoke ring, it immediately spreads evenly throughout the room in zero seconds. The headline is a tautology. @zeynep /1
        6 replies 13 retweets 127 likes
        Show this thread
      10. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 27 Apr 2021

        Enough already. This headline is dangerously misleading. Distance does a lot of work, even indoors, but if the location is enclosed then, OVER TIME, the air will mix to farther away places (though viruses also lose infectivity over time). @Marianne_Guenot https://twitter.com/wesyang/status/1387069955343097856 …pic.twitter.com/oToyKAIgEF

        5 replies 44 retweets 182 likes
        Show this thread
      11. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 27 Apr 2021

        zeynep tufekci Retweeted sam

        Thread⬆️ has many aerosol scientists. Our paper below explains why distance matters for airborne transmission. TBH, this is the cost of global health agencies not stepping up to provide correct transmission explanations. Misinformation thrives in a vacuum.https://twitter.com/samuelmehr/status/1386837096313368582?s=20 …

        zeynep tufekci added,

        sam @samuelmehr
        until now I had only read the "COVID is airborne" coverage and not the actual paper (in @TheLancet by @DFisman @zeynep et al) it is beautifully written and *utterly* convincing, a model of scientific prose https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)00869-2/fulltext … here's the whole piece: pic.twitter.com/VfxloWAwG4
        Show this thread
        3 replies 20 retweets 130 likes
        Show this thread
      12. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 28 Apr 2021

        Oh my goodness, STOP! That study—a model—did not find that distance offers "no protection". The model *assumed* the air was continuously and completely mixed in an enclosed space! That's not how real life works. Indoors, air does mix *over time* but also virus loses infectivity.pic.twitter.com/cbsnPGKuZo

        9 replies 67 retweets 326 likes
        Show this thread
      13. End of conversation

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