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zeynep's profile
zeynep tufekci
zeynep tufekci
zeynep tufekci
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@zeynep

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zeynep tufekciVerified account

@zeynep

Complex systems, wicked problems. Society, technology, science and more. @UNC professor. @NYTimes columnist. My newsletter is @insight: http://www.theinsight.org 

floating in a most peculiar way
theinsight.org
Joined August 2009

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    1. Jenny Rose Finkel Mason‏ @jrfinkel 20 Oct 2020
      Replying to @jrfinkel @zeynep

      ... filtration may result in increased risk of infection. Further research is needed to inform the widespread use of cloth masks globally. However, as a precautionary measure, cloth masks should not be recommended for HCWs, particularly in high-risk situations, and guidelines ...

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    2. Jenny Rose Finkel Mason‏ @jrfinkel 20 Oct 2020
      Replying to @jrfinkel @zeynep

      ... need to be updated.” And Results section includes “Cloth masks also had significantly higher rates of ILI compared with the control arm.” Control arm was “what you normally do” — they didn’t compare to “no masks” at all, though control was presumably somewhat unmasked. ...

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. Jenny Rose Finkel Mason‏ @jrfinkel 20 Oct 2020
      Replying to @jrfinkel @zeynep

      ... It doesn’t seem like his statement was a misrepresentation based on the paper’s conclusions/results. On the other hand, your phrasing “merely found that poorly-washed cloth masks weren't as good as surgical masks” does feel like a misrepresentation as it implies that ...

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    4. Jenny Rose Finkel Mason‏ @jrfinkel 20 Oct 2020
      Replying to @jrfinkel @zeynep

      ... they found cloth masks to be better than nothing, which was not a finding of the paper.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. Baris‏ @turkeyspride 20 Oct 2020
      Replying to @jrfinkel @zeynep

      Zeynep’s tweet reads more like what this study is not rather than implying anything specific. RP doesn’t imply but *states* that following advice regarding masks is submission. Both the abstract and added comments from the authors clearly state the control is PPE mask wearers

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. Jenny Rose Finkel Mason‏ @jrfinkel 20 Oct 2020
      Replying to @turkeyspride @zeynep

      What part of RP’s tweet do you think is misrepresentation? (That’s a sincere question.) The “submission” part is clearly his commentary on the situation and not scientific in any sense. To the best I can tell, everything his says is accurate, and not distorted. It is the only ...

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. Jenny Rose Finkel Mason‏ @jrfinkel 20 Oct 2020
      Replying to @jrfinkel @turkeyspride @zeynep

      ... RCT on cloth masks. The paper does say 97% of particles pass through, and that infection is 12x(!) higher than with surgical masks and 3x higher than the control for ILI, and for lab confirmed virus cloth masks have 1.65x that of surgical masks and 1.35x that of the ...

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. Jenny Rose Finkel Mason‏ @jrfinkel 20 Oct 2020
      Replying to @jrfinkel @turkeyspride @zeynep

      ... control. The conclusions say “the results caution against the use of cloth masks” and under limitations it says “The control arm was ‘standard practice’, which comprised mask use in a high proportion of participants. As such (without a no-mask control), the finding of a ...

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. Jenny Rose Finkel Mason‏ @jrfinkel 20 Oct 2020
      Replying to @jrfinkel @turkeyspride @zeynep

      ... much higher rate of infection in the cloth mask arm could be interpreted as harm caused by cloth masks, efficacy of medical masks, or most likely a combination of both.” Seriously, what specifically is the misrepresentation?

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    10. hiccupping into the future‏ @syysmyrskysta 20 Oct 2020
      Replying to @jrfinkel @turkeyspride @zeynep

      From the conclusion: "It is also unknown whether the rates of infection observed in the cloth mask arm are the same or higher than in HCWs who do not wear a mask, as almost all participants in the control arm used a mask."

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
      zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 20 Oct 2020
      Replying to @syysmyrskysta @jrfinkel @turkeyspride

      Plus it's not a study of source control, which is why the primary reason we recommend masking in the community, though increasing evidence it is also protective.

      6:18 PM - 20 Oct 2020
      • 1 Like
      • hiccupping into the future
      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        1. New conversation
        2. Jenny Rose Finkel Mason‏ @jrfinkel 20 Oct 2020
          Replying to @zeynep @turkeyspride

          It’s true that it’s not a study of source control, but then again none of the evidence *for* mask wearing (much less cloth mask wearing) is a source control RCT either. It’s all either 1. We blew into the fabric mask and measured how much was filtered. Which tells us next ...

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Jenny Rose Finkel Mason‏ @jrfinkel 20 Oct 2020
          Replying to @jrfinkel @zeynep @turkeyspride

          ... to nothing about how useful masks, as actually worn/used by the public, are at reducing transmission. Or 2. We compared a bunch of places and our regression shows they help. Which, if you accept studies like that for masks, it seems that you should also believe that HCQ ...

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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