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zeynep's profile
zeynep tufekci
zeynep tufekci
zeynep tufekci
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@zeynep

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zeynep tufekciVerified account

@zeynep

Complex systems, wicked problems. Society, technology, science and more. @UNC professor. @NYTimes columnist. My newsletter is @insight: http://www.theinsight.org 

floating in a most peculiar way
theinsight.org
Joined August 2009

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    2. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 24 Aug 2020
      Replying to @mattyglesias @zeynep

      This is condescending and wrong, Matt. Zeynep is not the intellectual midwife to awkward real experts who had trouble expressing their feelings, but someone who pushed hard against a near-universal consensus at great professional risk. Her name is on the research papers.

      2 replies 5 retweets 77 likes
    3. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 24 Aug 2020
      Replying to @Pinboard @mattyglesias @zeynep

      I recall you at the time buying up masks for personal use while your employer published explainers deprecating their use as baseless myth that would do more harm than good. She fought like a lion and did the work, so please don't mischaracterize it as "great popularizer"

      5 replies 1 retweet 38 likes
    4. Matthew Green‏Verified account @matthew_d_green 24 Aug 2020
      Replying to @Pinboard @mattyglesias @zeynep

      I think Zeynep is amazing but I think it’s a bad idea to tar the whole medical community with “there was near-universal consensus”. I think many doctors disagreed with the public-health authorities but didn’t have a way to say it.

      1 reply 1 retweet 6 likes
    5. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 24 Aug 2020
      Replying to @matthew_d_green @mattyglesias @zeynep

      I should specify that I’m referring to the public health authorities in the United States and our public intellectuals, not the medical system writ large, let alone the many people in East Asia who looked at this policy with incredulity

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    6. Matthew Green‏Verified account @matthew_d_green 24 Aug 2020
      Replying to @Pinboard @mattyglesias @zeynep

      I think Matt’s claim here is pretty valid: that the science community didn’t know how to muster a general discussion about how they didn’t agree with this advice being given by people in positions of authority, and Zeynep did.

      2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
    7. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 24 Aug 2020
      Replying to @matthew_d_green @Pinboard @mattyglesias

      I don’t really wanna get involved (no win) but the idea that the science community in the United States somehow actually agreed with masks being useful but I got to voice it is either ludicrous or they’re extremely good at keeping life-saving secrets in the middle of a pandemic.

      1 reply 4 retweets 20 likes
    8. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 24 Aug 2020
      Replying to @zeynep @matthew_d_green and

      If it wasn’t that recent, one could think it was plausible, that I just had the chance to voice something that they actually already knew. Instead I did my analysis and wrote my piece thinking it might end my career as a public intellectual. It was that against the grain. Anyway.

      3 replies 1 retweet 26 likes
    9. Matthew Green‏Verified account @matthew_d_green 24 Aug 2020
      Replying to @zeynep @Pinboard @mattyglesias

      That’s fair. And this point shouldn’t take away from what you did, and how you put yourself out there. Yet within a few weeks of your piece, the idea that masks were essential to preventing COVID had become ubiquitous within the community.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    10. Matthew Green‏Verified account @matthew_d_green 24 Aug 2020
      Replying to @matthew_d_green @zeynep and

      I want to give some credit to the scientific community based on the notion that these ideas were out there in scientists’ mind and that they needed a catalyst to crystallize around, and you helped to provide that.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 24 Aug 2020
      Replying to @matthew_d_green @Pinboard @mattyglesias

      Yeah, I guess my role was to read these "scientists" minds where they held these very secret thoughts while loudly claiming the opposite. It's been an interesting few months for a telepath like me! (Btw, WHO guidance took till June to change and it still has the science wrong).

      5:54 PM - 24 Aug 2020
      • 15 Likes
      • rm -lininger First of all, Guy Goldhagen Michael Kirk David Foulser Pavol Vaskovic ihnorton Cat Yzma Doug Johnson Hatlem
      2 replies 0 retweets 15 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Matthew Green‏Verified account @matthew_d_green 24 Aug 2020
          Replying to @zeynep @Pinboard @mattyglesias

          I guess I generally dislike any argument like @Pinboard’s that says “the whole scientific community was wrong” rather than that “there was diversity of thought in the expert community but the dissenters were afraid to speak out loudly against authoritative figurss.”

          2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
        3. Matthew Green‏Verified account @matthew_d_green 24 Aug 2020
          Replying to @matthew_d_green @zeynep and

          The latter is more my experience of science, and I think the sea change in thought that happened by April was largely driven by a combination of this diversity of opinion and people (perhaps not coincidentally outside the exact field) having the courage to raise objections.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        4. Show replies
        1. New conversation
        2. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 24 Aug 2020
          Replying to @zeynep @matthew_d_green and

          Anyway, I don't need credit or praise, and honestly I'm more than fine but next time, I'd suggest more open-eyed assessment of what the reality was, not because of me, but women's role is routinely minimized to being "communicators" rather than analysts or thinkers on their own.

          1 reply 2 retweets 17 likes
        3. Matthew Green‏Verified account @matthew_d_green 24 Aug 2020
          Replying to @zeynep @Pinboard @mattyglesias

          Zeynep, I’ve worked with you and I’m hurt you’d think that was my opinion. My assumption was that neither you (nor I) have any expertise in this area beyond the ability to read others’ existing work and synthesize it effectively. But maybe I’m wrong about that.

          1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
        4. Show replies

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