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zeynep's profile
zeynep tufekci
zeynep tufekci
zeynep tufekci
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@zeynep

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zeynep tufekciVerified account

@zeynep

Complex systems, wicked problems. Society, technology, science and more. @UNC professor. @NYTimes columnist. My newsletter is @insight: http://www.theinsight.org 

floating in a most peculiar way
theinsight.org
Joined August 2009

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    1. Bill Hanage‏Verified account @BillHanage 6 Jun 2020

      Bill Hanage Retweeted Ben Cowling

      I am presuming the research cited is the Chu et al review in @TheLancet. I’m not sure that’s the best source of evidence when it comes to mask use in the community vs healthcare because of training in the latter setting and confounders https://twitter.com/bencowling88/status/1269139370121953280?s=21 … is 5/n

      Bill Hanage added,

      Ben CowlingVerified account @bencowling88
      (1/16) However, I don't follow the argument that the guidance has changed because of new evidence. The evidence has been there all along. I have a few comments on the most recent review in the Lancet https://twitter.com/bencowling88/status/1269076755005861888 …
      Show this thread
      2 replies 1 retweet 7 likes
      Show this thread
    2. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 6 Jun 2020
      Replying to @BillHanage

      zeynep tufekci Retweeted zeynep tufekci

      Note "false sense of security" claim in the guidance has no citations. I briefed this guidance committee on how that worry was not just without evidence, there is evidence to the contrary. Disappointed they still just hand-waved it in. Paper under review:https://twitter.com/zeynep/status/1268935532396130305 …

      zeynep tufekci added,

      zeynep tufekciVerified account @zeynep
      Here's a preprint of a paper (I'm a co-author) where we review the "false sense of security" claim and explain why it doesn't stand to evidence at all, and why, on the contrary, universal masks would be expected to lessen stigma and heighten solidarity. https://www.preprints.org/manuscript/202004.0203/v2 … pic.twitter.com/2tDzvYGNVr
      Show this thread
      3 replies 4 retweets 9 likes
    3. Bill Hanage‏Verified account @BillHanage 6 Jun 2020
      Replying to @zeynep

      Interesting! Thanks for sharing. There’s something about mask use that veers into the ideological

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    4. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 6 Jun 2020
      Replying to @BillHanage

      Indeed! Lack of RCTs are cited as a reason not to mask despite other evidence, but then evidence for harms and worries is all without citations and mostly hand-waving. Then, handwashing for COVID has less RCT evidence but nobody worries about that (but, of course, let's do it!).

      2 replies 1 retweet 8 likes
    5. Bill Hanage‏Verified account @BillHanage 6 Jun 2020
      Replying to @zeynep

      It’s definitely too nuanced for Twitter, but there is something interesting about what counts as evidence, and how to make decisions when you don’t have all the evidence you’d like. RCTs if possible are great, but they’re not the *only* source of evidence.

      2 replies 1 retweet 5 likes
    6. Zoë McLaren, PhD‏ @ZoeMcLaren 6 Jun 2020
      Replying to @BillHanage @zeynep

      I think some of the issue is that most academics aren’t courageous enough to take a stand on the evidence without a gold standard RCT to back them up. The sum total of the evidence backs up @zeynep’s points. But too many are afraid of the very small chance masks could backfire.

      2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
    7. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 6 Jun 2020
      Replying to @ZoeMcLaren @BillHanage

      Yeah, I understand that, of course. RCTs catch so many things that are otherwise hard to tease out. One problem is in the "harm on both sides" and "time is of the essence" situations. That said, the only harms here were shortage (for non-cloth masks) and the Deaf community.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    8. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 6 Jun 2020
      Replying to @zeynep @ZoeMcLaren @BillHanage

      Self-infection? How can that be more harmful than no masks? Not in a hospital, and if outside of mask is contaminated, then the person would be infected without a mask. If person already infected, not a concern. False sense of security? No evidence and reasons to think otherwise.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    9. Zoë McLaren, PhD‏ @ZoeMcLaren 6 Jun 2020
      Replying to @zeynep @BillHanage

      Completely agree with you @zeynep!

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    10. Zoë McLaren, PhD‏ @ZoeMcLaren 6 Jun 2020
      Replying to @ZoeMcLaren @zeynep @BillHanage

      And thanks for your work hammering on this point since very early on.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 6 Jun 2020
      Replying to @ZoeMcLaren @BillHanage

      Thank you! Sorry I'm still disappointed so going on and on. I'll stop. This isn't how we should have faced the first five months of a pandemic. I was looking at some pre-COVID pandemic fiction and CDC and WHO are always portrayed as so competent. Quick. On top of it. Sigh.

      6:49 AM - 6 Jun 2020
      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Zoë McLaren, PhD‏ @ZoeMcLaren 6 Jun 2020
          Replying to @zeynep @BillHanage

          No need to apologize! You have good reason to be frustrated. So many lives lost now and in the future needlessly because of this!

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Bill Hanage‏Verified account @BillHanage 6 Jun 2020
          Replying to @ZoeMcLaren @zeynep

          I like the point re fiction. Suspect post pandemic fiction will be different

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. End of conversation

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