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zeynep's profile
zeynep tufekci
zeynep tufekci
zeynep tufekci
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@zeynep

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zeynep tufekciVerified account

@zeynep

Complex systems, wicked problems. Society, technology, science and more. @UNC professor. @NYTimes columnist. My newsletter is @insight: http://www.theinsight.org 

floating in a most peculiar way
theinsight.org
Joined August 2009

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    1. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 5 Oct 2018
      Replying to @codybrown

      See, exactly what I mean. Read the piece I linked to—that thing got rejected! Again and again and again. Shot down by concerned reviewers. That's exactly it: the trio deliberately fudged how they talk about it so everyone thinks it got accepted. They aren't out to show problems.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    2. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 5 Oct 2018
      Replying to @zeynep @codybrown

      I don't mean crap doesn't get published—there are predatory journals that will "publish" anything in any field without review (these are flat out fake journals). Also, some terrible stuff can eventually be published if you try hard. But that's not how you evaluate a whole field.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    3. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 5 Oct 2018
      Replying to @zeynep @codybrown

      That paper did not get "glowing reviews", it got the opposite. That you think the opposite of truth is why I call this trio's misrepresentation the actual hoax. We need better bullshit detection, and better understanding of how do you actually do an audit study. This is a stunt.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    4. codyb‏Verified account @codybrown 6 Oct 2018
      Replying to @zeynep

      the opposite of truth? I read most of the reviews before chiming in. Some pushback but some are very supportive. This was also one of the few papers that was in review. the seven others got in with glowing feedback. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1WVJQjxY6pCClO3mcnsBK6dfU_BGiN6HC/view …pic.twitter.com/LRVX3WhOdK

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 6 Oct 2018
      Replying to @codybrown

      One, the paper was rejected. Roundly rejected. Multiple times. Two, that reviewer came forward. He's a grad student who was doing his very first review, and he used positive language from a review he just got because he wanted to have *something* positive to say in a rejection.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    6. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 6 Oct 2018
      Replying to @zeynep @codybrown

      So all these hoaxers got is rejection (which they hid and misled so that it got *widely* reported by people with PhDs as "accepted" paper—not a coincidence, they misrepresented the rejection) and exposed that .. some fields encourage "put in a positive sentence in rejection". 🤷‍♀️

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    7. codyb‏Verified account @codybrown 6 Oct 2018
      Replying to @zeynep

      what about the 7 other papers that did make it in?

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 6 Oct 2018
      Replying to @codybrown

      Read the write-up I linked to. If you fake data, you can get in to many places, as I keep saying, including the Lancet. They had very very marginal success for huge effort, and mostly by faking data, and given their dishonest representation, I'm not even sure we know all attempts

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 6 Oct 2018
      Replying to @zeynep @codybrown

      Faking data to get in somewhere (fraud) is different than a hoax (a la Sokal). Also read:. https://slate.com/technology/2018/10/grievance-studies-hoax-not-academic-scandal.html … Honestly, I'd have expected more success. All decentralized gatekeeping systems can be penetrated some of the time. The question is how easy and often?

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    10. zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 6 Oct 2018
      Replying to @zeynep @codybrown

      The irony is this is a shoddy study misrepresenting the resuts and overselling them. I wouldn't let this write-up through peer review! I'd say, go do this again and be honest about what you got. Whatever one's opinions about these fields... This "hoax" is not honest or strong.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      zeynep tufekci‏Verified account @zeynep 6 Oct 2018
      Replying to @zeynep @codybrown

      (I want to re-emphasize I find Sokal to be substantive and while I wouldn't agree with every opinion he had, he's very much worth engaging. These are folks who don't like certain fields (fine!) but pulled a stunt which they misrepresent. Pls do read the two links in this thread.)

      3:52 PM - 6 Oct 2018
      • 1 Like
      • codyb
      0 replies 0 retweets 1 like

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