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wycats's profile
Yehuda Katz 🥨
Yehuda Katz 🥨
Yehuda Katz  🥨
Verified account
@wycats

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Yehuda Katz  🥨Verified account

@wycats

Tilde Co-Founder, OSS enthusiast and world traveler.

Portland, OR
yehudakatz.com
Joined August 2007

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    1. Yehuda Katz  🥨‏Verified account @wycats 22 Dec 2017
      Replying to @TheLarkInn @parceljs

      I don't agree with your analysis. The current "everything is an event" architecture causes even internal code to be implicitly coupled to execution order. It also makes it very hard to build composable plugins that reliably work in the presence of other plugins.

      1 reply 2 retweets 7 likes
    2. Sean Thomas Larkin (肖恩)‏ @TheLarkInn 22 Dec 2017
      Replying to @wycats @parceljs

      Consious Tradeoff

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. Sean Thomas Larkin (肖恩)‏ @TheLarkInn 22 Dec 2017
      Replying to @TheLarkInn @wycats @parceljs

      However we do support before/after, etc now. So its getting _less unpredictable_

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    4. Yehuda Katz  🥨‏Verified account @wycats 22 Dec 2017
      Replying to @TheLarkInn @parceljs

      I guess I'm just saying all abstractions are not created equal. One of the big insights of React is that passing functions as props and calling them is better than firing an event into the ether and hoping someone is listening.

      3 replies 6 retweets 15 likes
    5. Yehuda Katz  🥨‏Verified account @wycats 22 Dec 2017
      Replying to @wycats @TheLarkInn @parceljs

      Among other benefits: - When you call a function wrong, you get errors right away that pause your debugger - Wrapping functions is easy to understand, and even higher order functions are easier to step through than evented patterns.

      1 reply 2 retweets 8 likes
    6. Sean Thomas Larkin (肖恩)‏ @TheLarkInn 22 Dec 2017
      Replying to @wycats @parceljs

      Truth! So what's the tradeoff them Katz?

      2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
    7. Chris Freeman‏ @15lettermax 22 Dec 2017
      Replying to @TheLarkInn @wycats @parceljs

      I think @wycats is saying that the “tradeoff” isn’t readily apparent. i.e. Using the “everything is an event” approach costs you some determinism, but gains you _________? Without that blank filled in, the event-based approach isn’t a trade off, it’s strictly a drawback.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    8. Sean Thomas Larkin (肖恩)‏ @TheLarkInn 22 Dec 2017
      Replying to @15lettermax @wycats @parceljs

      Strictly a drawback? I would say gains are: - Extreme Loose Coupling (especially within, synchronization etc) - Easy to pivot, add new features, remove features. - Super flexible as event can be anything - Highly Distributed Theres also tight coupling as well.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    9. Yehuda Katz  🥨‏Verified account @wycats 22 Dec 2017
      Replying to @TheLarkInn @15lettermax @parceljs

      It's not so easy to add new features because the exact details of the timing of the events and when the consumers run become undocumented "implicit" APIs. Loose coupling is quite often in conflict with API evolution if there's a lot of implicit API surface.

      1 reply 1 retweet 6 likes
    10. Sean Thomas Larkin (肖恩)‏ @TheLarkInn 22 Dec 2017
      Replying to @wycats @15lettermax @parceljs

      It's the implicit piece which is hard. But changes we _just_ made now make all of the api surface explicit. Now you can only hook into "taps" (aka events) that exist, etc. The best part is finding out through "ts-check" event string that aren't even used anymore. 😊pic.twitter.com/nHBOOlPJrV

      3 replies 1 retweet 2 likes
      Yehuda Katz  🥨‏Verified account @wycats 22 Dec 2017
      Replying to @TheLarkInn @15lettermax @parceljs

      It's not just the explicit API. Event style APIs create a huge amount of implicit surface that is nearly impossible to document and account for. It's sometimes worth it but very expensive to get right.

      1:14 PM - 22 Dec 2017
      • 5 Likes
      • Phips Peter kungfukenny Aurelio Ogliari Patrick Gotthardt Sean Thomas Larkin (肖恩)
      1 reply 0 retweets 5 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Sean Thomas Larkin (肖恩)‏ @TheLarkInn 22 Dec 2017
          Replying to @wycats @15lettermax @parceljs

          Yup. I even think @wSokra saying a few months back, if he would write it today, it probably would likely look at bit different.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        3. Sam Saccone‏Verified account @samccone 22 Dec 2017
          Replying to @TheLarkInn @wycats and

          Does webpack have any guarantees around hermetic and reproducible builds?

          1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
        4. Sean Thomas Larkin (肖恩)‏ @TheLarkInn 22 Dec 2017
          Replying to @samccone @wycats and

          I've still not entirely wrapped my head around this concept so please correct me if I misunderstand: When a build happens, if nothing changes it should produce the same output every time?

          2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        5. Fernando Montoya‏ @montogeek 22 Dec 2017
          Replying to @TheLarkInn @samccone and

          yes

          2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
        6. Sean Thomas Larkin (肖恩)‏ @TheLarkInn 22 Dec 2017
          Replying to @montogeek @samccone and

          Then yes. We even guard against this on the surface (although shallow with example) in our stats tests IE: our stats and output is snapshotted to ensure hashes do not change and fail if they differ across platform etc.https://github.com/webpack/webpack/tree/master/test/statsCases/preset-detailed …

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        7. Sean Thomas Larkin (肖恩)‏ @TheLarkInn 22 Dec 2017
          Replying to @TheLarkInn @montogeek and

          Sam, there could be more depth in this. Like we could technically spin up a test case specifically for hermiticity (sp?) and snapshot resulting exact code etc.,

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        8. Sean Thomas Larkin (肖恩)‏ @TheLarkInn 22 Dec 2017
          Replying to @TheLarkInn @montogeek and

          Does that answer your question accurately?

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        9. Sam Saccone‏Verified account @samccone 22 Dec 2017
          Replying to @TheLarkInn @montogeek and

          it does! thanks!!

          1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
        10. 2 more replies

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