Side note- did the Japanese accept unconditional surrender? The Byrnes note?
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Replying to @NuclearAnthro
They offered conditional surrender on August 10th. The US rejected this and dropped some more conventional bombs on them while they had an attempted coup. Then on August 14th the Emperor gave his radio broadcast accepting unconditional surrender.
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Replying to @wellerstein @NuclearAnthro
I thought the US allowed one condition, that Emperor Hirohito be kept as a figurehead? From what I read, the US felt they had no time to reject that condition because the Soviets were cutting through Korea like butter, after having conquered Manchuria in less than a week.
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Replying to @JennyImpatient @NuclearAnthro
They required and accepted unconditional surrender and then, later decided to allow him as a figurehead. Which is to say: if they knew they were going to do that (it isn't clear they did), they COULD have offered conditional surrender (and maybe gotten it sooner), but didn't.
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Replying to @wellerstein
My understanding was that Byrnes Note comment about ultimate form of Japanese gov being chosen by Japanese was nod to keeping emperor as Japanese were unlikely to dump Him?
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Replying to @NuclearAnthro
It is deliberately vague, but the Japanese were worried that the Emperor would be tried as a war criminal, for example. The Byrnes note deliberately does not diverge from Potsdam which deliberately does not clarify these issues.
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Replying to @wellerstein
So it was deliberately set up to avoid commitments but also to encourage interpretations of a commitment/likelihood re: the Emperor?
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Replying to @NuclearAnthro
I don't think it was set up to very encouraging. Saying, "after a lengthy occupation, we're gonna let the people decide how the government works from then on (if we don't have you executed first)" is not very encouraging.
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Replying to @wellerstein @NuclearAnthro
This is why essentially only the Emperor could make the move to accept the surrender conditions. Nobody else in the high command would have put him on the line like that.
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Replying to @wellerstein @NuclearAnthro
I'm just gonna leave this here since I head home from the library shortly and need to run our shutdown procedures:https://foreignpolicy.com/2013/05/30/the-bomb-didnt-beat-japan-stalin-did/ …
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Yeah I don't totally see eye to eye with Ward on this (which he knows and is a good sport about). I certainly agree the Soviet declaration of war was a large part of it. But whether things would have been different without the bomb... I don't think we have the evidence to say.
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(Or without the invasion, for that matter.)
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Replying to @wellerstein @Chris_Levesque_
Time machine! How many times to run the experiment b/f we can get a p < .05 out of it?
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End of conversation
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