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webdevMason's profile
Mason 🏃‍♂️✂️
Mason 🏃‍♂️✂️
Mason  🏃‍♂️ ✂️
@webdevMason

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Mason  🏃‍♂️ ✂️

@webdevMason

patreon.com/masonhartman
Joined July 2015

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    1. Peter Wang‏ @pwang 4 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @pwang @ESYudkowsky @webdevMason

      So I reflect the original question back: How do you demarcate the realm of "programming" such that 750MM excel programmers are on one side of the line, and all the fizz-buzz-segfault l33t hackers are on the other?

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    2. Peter Wang‏ @pwang 4 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @pwang @ESYudkowsky @webdevMason

      More importantly, what does the salary distribution of Excel-wielding VPs vs. Emacs coding grunts say about the actual economic value of these different partitions of coders?

      1 reply 0 retweets 4 likes
    3. Mason  🏃‍♂️ ✂️‏ @webdevMason 4 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @pwang @ESYudkowsky

      “Most programmers are terrible at teaching real people to program... Basic programming should be taught at the whiteboard, not the screen.” Wut I don’t think *anything* should be taught at the whiteboard if it can be avoided & it seems borderline insane to do that with code

      2 replies 2 retweets 3 likes
    4. Peter Wang‏ @pwang 5 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @webdevMason @ESYudkowsky

      I don't think it can be avoided. I learned to code by starting with simple runtimes (LOGO, BASIC). But once you get beyond that to procedural abstraction, collections of refs, loop variables, etc. - then you need to get a whiteboard and really walk folks thru the runtime model.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. Peter Wang‏ @pwang 5 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @pwang @webdevMason @ESYudkowsky

      I didn't empathize with the lack of ability to model arbitrary systems until I tried explain for-loop (in Python) to somebody in a car. They *could not* understand how or why the loop var changed values.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. Peter Wang‏ @pwang 5 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @pwang @webdevMason @ESYudkowsky

      I have sheets & sheets of paper from when I was 12 or 13, and I was designing my Star Trek BBS game, with full ANSI graphics and a random universe generator. There are functions I wrote out, traced through the execution, thought about corner cases, etc.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. Peter Wang‏ @pwang 5 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @pwang @webdevMason @ESYudkowsky

      I don't disagree that you have to actually write code in order to learn to program. But the idea that you spend most of your time in front of the screen, throwing code at a compiler until your narrow unit tests pass, is part of what's wrong with the industry.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. Peter Wang‏ @pwang 5 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @pwang @webdevMason @ESYudkowsky

      Really learning how to code is not easy nor formulaic for every type of learner. But I maintain that it is primarily a *reasoning* skill, not a procedural one tied to memorizing keywords & APIs & git commands. Like learning a musical or artistic instrument: technique vs. skill.

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    9. Mason  🏃‍♂️ ✂️‏ @webdevMason 5 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @pwang @ESYudkowsky

      I'm not saying "try to explain code to a non-coder in a car." I'm not saying you can't sketch stuff out on paper, especially when you're away from the computer. I'm not saying to flail desperately at a unit test when you don't have the first clue why it's failing.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    10. Mason  🏃‍♂️ ✂️‏ @webdevMason 5 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @webdevMason @pwang @ESYudkowsky

      I'm saying it makes no sense to learn to code at the whiteboard vs. at a computer, just as it makes no sense to learn the violin or how to paint at the whiteboard. There'll be times when it makes sense to use a whiteboard to capture complexity, but usually it's the wrong medium.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
      Mason  🏃‍♂️ ✂️‏ @webdevMason 5 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @webdevMason @pwang @ESYudkowsky

      To imply that any of what I said remotely suggests that coding is a procedural skill or rote memorization task is straight-up strawmanning, and I think I'm done responding unless you want to start considering what I'm saying in good faith.

      8:24 AM - 5 Feb 2019
      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        1. Peter Wang‏ @pwang 5 Feb 2019
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          Replying to @webdevMason @ESYudkowsky

          Sorry, didn't mean to strawman. But I absolutely maintain that it's ineffective to teach *muggles* (not proto-devs) how to reason about modern systems by primarily plopping them down in front of a keyboard. Ofc keyboard time is required for leveling up from apprentice to master.

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