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webdevMason's profile
Mason 🏃‍♂️✂️
Mason 🏃‍♂️✂️
Mason  🏃‍♂️ ✂️
@webdevMason

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Mason  🏃‍♂️ ✂️

@webdevMason

LA → Oakland
calendly.com/masonhartman
Joined July 2015

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    1. Carlos De la Guardia‏ @dela3499 26 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @ToKTeacher @webdevMason @danielgross

      Yeah. (e.g. play arpeggios of equally spaced notes from random chords all from the same randomly-selected key)

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    2. Ernst‏ @ernsterlanson 26 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @dela3499 @ToKTeacher and

      I think you can create something that *sounds* good in that way, however that is because we have heard it before so it is not something new. There is a difference between music *sounding* good and being objectively good. Creating the latter is hard

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    3. Brett Hall‏ @ToKTeacher 26 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @ernsterlanson @dela3499 and

      Again: I admit vast ignorance here. But it seems analogous to AI visual art. You may get pretty patterns via following an algorithm (I recall when "visualisers" were popular in Apple and Microsoft music players). I mean: pretty to look at. But: original art? Actual creativity?

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    4. Adil Zeshan‏ @adilzeshan 26 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @ToKTeacher @ernsterlanson and

      Not creative currently, whether it is generative art or generative music. The programming that causes such pretty phenomena cannot critique its own efforts - past, present, and future - unless a skilled enough programmer supplies the prerequisite "instruction from without".

      2 replies 1 retweet 3 likes
    5. Carlos De la Guardia‏ @dela3499 26 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @adilzeshan @ToKTeacher and

      Yeah, the question isn’t really about whether a program can make something that sounds good. It’s “What does the program do when it confronts a musical problem - when something sounds bad?”

      2 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
    6. Mason  🏃‍♂️ ✂️‏ @webdevMason 26 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @dela3499 @adilzeshan and

      I'm having a really difficult time mapping any of these concerns/assumed limitations to the actual process of e.g. training a neural net. Do you need human feedback? Yes. But that's exactly what platforms like Instagram & Soundcloud are for

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    7. Brett Hall‏ @ToKTeacher 26 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @webdevMason @dela3499 and

      It’s a philosophical question: can an algorithm be written such that largely *absent frequent human interventions* good music can be produced (in other words: some kind of automated composition). No problem with the idea that *with human creative input/feedback* it’s possible.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    8. Mason  🏃‍♂️ ✂️‏ @webdevMason 26 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @ToKTeacher @dela3499 and

      Humans broadly suck without external human feedback, too

      1 reply 1 retweet 1 like
    9. Brett Hall‏ @ToKTeacher 26 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @webdevMason @dela3499 and

      Sure, but there's "that sucks" (poor attempt at solitary creativity) and "that sucks" (not individually creative at all, and not going to be). People might often display the former, but by definition are never the latter. For dumb AI/neural nets it's basically the opposite.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    10. Kitt Johnson‏ @KittJohnson_ 27 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @ToKTeacher @webdevMason and

      Indeed. It's no argument to claim that humans often need feedback, when some humans need little and produce some of the the most consequential improvements to our knowledge. A.I. as it currently stands is incapable of of doing the latter, but is fundamentally bound to the former.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Mason  🏃‍♂️ ✂️‏ @webdevMason 27 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @KittJohnson_ @ToKTeacher and

      If you're defining creativity in a way that necessarily requires consciousness/agency, AI as we know it does not and cannot have that. I don't care enough to argue that point; if humans hear AI-compused music and think "how beautiful/interesting/creative," that's sufficient to me

      8:01 AM - 27 Nov 2018
      3 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        1. Mason  🏃‍♂️ ✂️‏ @webdevMason 27 Nov 2018
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          Replying to @webdevMason @KittJohnson_ and

          Likewise, if you want to call AI a "tool" rather than a "composer" in instances where it generates the bulk/entirely of a song & a human tweaks or just *selects from an array of outputs*, fine? My point is that automated generation could outpace friction-reduction in that market.

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        2. Ernst‏ @ernsterlanson 27 Nov 2018
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          Replying to @webdevMason @KittJohnson_ and

          Yes but you can also define *creating art* in a way that does not involve creativity. To create something that makes people say "how beautiful" etc need not involve creativity. Just take some random kittens or sunsets:)

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Kitt Johnson‏ @KittJohnson_ 27 Nov 2018
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          Replying to @ernsterlanson @webdevMason and

          Kittens could contain aesthetic knowledge, generated by blind bio-evolution. With sunsets, it could be the case that the laws of physics share some symmetries with the laws of aesthetics and that's why they're beautiful. Without creativity, you can't make reliable progress though

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
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        1. Kitt Johnson‏ @KittJohnson_ 27 Nov 2018
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          Replying to @webdevMason @ToKTeacher and

          Fair enough. I guess I'm interested in why someone would say, "how beautiful", and currently this is always because there's some creative steering going on by a person. And to your other point, I would say that 'automated generation' is just another form of friction-reduction.

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