I'm not against redistribution, and I think it's safe to assume you, I, and Tyler would roughly agree on how to do it. I do think the "you are the global 1%" messaging implies a problem with wealth (and even relatively minor wealth!) & has screwed up a lot of EAs' thinking
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Fair. It’s just... if this take on EA is almost entirely novel *to me*, and if you have to be more involved in EA than *I* was to get the “real” message, there’s either a real problem with information transfer or a really serious disconnect between leaders & the movement
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Idk, I think
@webdevMason's expectations are kind of unrealistic. Anytime you have 100s-1000s of people thinking about a complex topic, there's going to be a lot of non-overlap btwn exactly how they'd define key terms, exactly what they think the central focus should be, etc2 replies 0 retweets 1 like -
I am making the claim that most EAs think EA is primarily about redistribution — broadly defined as moving resources non-transactionally — and explicitly not primarily about growth.
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Julia Galef Retweeted Mason 🏃♂️ ✂️
TBC I was replying to this tweet of yours, which I thought was about something else (inconsistent messaging from EA):https://twitter.com/webdevMason/status/1052956898318643200 …
Julia Galef added,
Mason 🏃♂️ ✂️ @webdevMasonReplying to @robertwiblin @DavidDeutschOxf @juliagalefFair. It’s just... if this take on EA is almost entirely novel *to me*, and if you have to be more involved in EA than *I* was to get the “real” message, there’s either a real problem with information transfer or a really serious disconnect between leaders & the movement1 reply 0 retweets 1 like -
Replying to @juliagalef @webdevMason and
As I've said, I agree EA isn't primarily about growth, but disagree EA is primarily about redistribution (except for some very broad & nonstandard definition of redistribution that includes things like getting factory farms to go cage-free & making sure the world doesn't blow up)
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I don’t think I know what a standard definition of redistribution is, or a better term for “moving resources non-transactionally.” Insofar as EA is primarily about “doing good stuff better,” fair, I guess, although utterly lacking in content2 replies 0 retweets 3 likes -
I think you're strawmanning. "Using reason and evidence to figure out how to do the most good" (what I said) != "doing good stuff better" (what you said). And yes, a single phrase cannot contain all the content around what we consider "good", but you can read the websites, (cont)
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Replying to @juliagalef @webdevMason and
... and if you do you'll see it's not empty. Basically all EA cashes out "good" in terms of the welfare of sentient beings, in a consequentialist, scope-sensitive way, w/out unfairly prioritizing a single time period, locality, or species. This is very unusual.
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It feels like between you and Rob, I can't nail down a goalpost. If I zoom in, I'm ignoring x, y, & z; if I zoom out, I'm strawmanning. I agree that I'm having trouble finding the right level of resolution to carry a convo forward, but it doesn't feel like I'm getting much help.
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Well, usually when it feels like a disagreement keeps slipping away, and goalposts keep shifting, a good thing to do is to pin down an empirically testable prediction we disagree on. Which I'm totally happy to do; also happy to drop this if you feel like it's not your circus.
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Happy to give feedback on e.g. a community survey, assuming (a) this ideological gap between the leadership and the rank-and-file might actually exist, and (b) might present a problem worth identifying and correcting, but otherwise: not my circus
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