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vgr's profile
Venkatesh Rao
Venkatesh Rao
Venkatesh Rao
@vgr

Tweets

Venkatesh Rao

@vgr

Conversational account. For work follow @ribbonfarm, @breaking_smart, @artofgig. Tweets are 90% vacuous views, apathetically held. Mediocritopian. IKEA builder.

Los Angeles, CA
venkateshrao.com
Joined August 2007

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    1. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Sep 15
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      Replying to @NickPinkston @letkma

      I’ve done some modeling on this. Design for durability makes a huge impact on carbon impact, and design for repairability is one of the big levers there. The landfill is not the problem (sequestered carbon) it’s the fact that new things are made as fast as old things go landfill.

      2 replies 0 retweets 4 likes
    2. Nick Pinkston  🌐‏ @NickPinkston Sep 15
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      Replying to @vgr @letkma

      Show us the model. I'm wondering what items you're repairing and if you're counting cost of labor (including you)

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Sep 15
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      Replying to @NickPinkston @letkma

      NDAed work 😂

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    4. Nick Pinkston  🌐‏ @NickPinkston Sep 15
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      Replying to @vgr @letkma

      Maybe give your best and a modest example? If not I remain skeptical of this approach for most things. I'd also watch your repair frequency assumptions along with full cycle manufacturing CapEx payback and incremental batch economics

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Sep 15
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      Replying to @NickPinkston @letkma

      Sorry, can’t. This was a serious larger project involving several others. But Ellen MacArthur foundation stuff on circular economy has some broad strokes backgroundhttps://www.ellenmacarthurfoundation.org/circular-economy/concept …

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. Nick Pinkston  🌐‏ @NickPinkston Sep 15
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      Replying to @vgr @letkma

      I'm not opposed to designing things to recycle, reuse, etc better, but my instinct tells me entropy will win and that carbon taxes + public R&D/venture funding are likely enough, and I'm unsure they'd come to this conclusion. Is your project going to be public?

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    7. Alex Kozak‏ @alexkozak Sep 16
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      Replying to @NickPinkston @vgr @letkma

      don't forget the emissions from moving all that plastic bullshit around too, Nick! it really adds up. carbon tax would be fine but why not design better. (I recall looking into this but don't have a cite atm)

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. Nick Pinkston  🌐‏ @NickPinkston Sep 16
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      Replying to @alexkozak @vgr @letkma

      Yea sure, I hope people try this approach if they believe the math. I'm just skeptical that a circular economy is realistically better than other means. There are many examples of "built to last" products having average use lifespans below the energy payback period (ie net loss).

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. brennan‏ @letkma Sep 16
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      Replying to @NickPinkston @alexkozak @vgr

      this is my cynicism / experience in industrial design too: you can spend a heck of a lot of design and tooling time on making something good and repairable, a lot more resources to build it, and people throw it out anyway. I'm all for right to repair, but nearly no one does it

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    10. Nick Pinkston  🌐‏ @NickPinkston Sep 16
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      Replying to @letkma @alexkozak @vgr

      Yea same here - I keep thinking of the example of a stainless water bottle where most users never used it long enough to pay back the upfront energy investment.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Sep 16
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      Replying to @NickPinkston @letkma @alexkozak

      Yeah it’s not a panacea. Plastic straws and cloth totes are other examples. It’s a mix of targeted redesign, proper labeling, modeling and imitation, and incentives. Designing for durability and repairability as a general default in isolation won’t work.

      7:43 AM - 16 Sep 2020
      3 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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        2. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Sep 16
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          Replying to @vgr @NickPinkston and

          Consumption behaviors are a form of religion. Probably deeper rooted. This is a harder equilibrium to shift than religion. And harder than energy use shift to renewables too.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. brennan‏ @letkma Sep 16
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          Replying to @vgr @NickPinkston @alexkozak

          that would be my takeaway, we could regulate manufacturing as much as possible but in the end it's a consumer culture / incentive thing. stand in any walmart and guess how many average people own screwdrivers, have the time / interest / skill to diagnose and fix something, etc

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
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        1. Nick Pinkston  🌐‏ @NickPinkston Sep 16
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          Replying to @vgr @letkma @alexkozak

          The real question is what are the assumptions of those models. Greenwashers will overstate as-used product lifetimes / disposable product externalities while understating their "green" product. This is why I like to say: "carbon tax and chill", as CO2 price will enforce true cost

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        2. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Sep 16
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          Replying to @vgr @NickPinkston and

          But the larger point is, there’s no way to decarbonize without shifting consumption patterns to a lower-emissions equilibrium. There’s only so far you can get with taxes, cap-and-trade, and carbon credits. And with matter unlike energy there’s fewer big levers like renewables.

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Nick Pinkston  🌐‏ @NickPinkston Sep 16
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          Replying to @vgr @letkma @alexkozak

          Carbon tax / sequestration seems like the true panacea. It could be done at massive scale while the economy adjusts. I don't see what would limit it if carbon tax / credits could provide the funding.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
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