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vgr's profile
Venkatesh Rao
Venkatesh Rao
Venkatesh Rao
@vgr

Tweets

Venkatesh Rao

@vgr

This is my conversational account. For my work follow @ribbonfarm, @breaking_smart, @artofgig. Tweets are 90% vacuous views, apathetically held. Mediocritopian.

Los Angeles, CA
venkateshrao.com
Joined August 2007

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    1. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 27
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      To put it another way, if Einstein hadn’t happened, there’s a good chance relativity wouldn’t have happened till decades later. But if these 4 hadn’t happened, science fiction would totally still have happened, right on schedule. Just with different initial condition biases.

      5 replies 3 retweets 29 likes
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    2. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 27
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      Jerbs for the mediocrities 😎

      1 reply 0 retweets 11 likes
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    3. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 27
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      I don’t think you can rationally calculate and strategize your way to a mediocrity leverage point. You have to flow your way there by just letting go and pumping out your life energy down the channels of least resistance.

      2 replies 4 retweets 33 likes
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    4. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 27
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      It also seems clear that they didn’t quite realize they were making history until quite a while after they had done it. That’s another marker. When you solve a historic math or science problem, you usually know it right away. That’s what it seems like from the biographies.

      2 replies 2 retweets 19 likes
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    5. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 27
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      Still reading. Will add to this thread as I read.

      1 reply 0 retweets 5 likes
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    6. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 27
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      Tech pioneering seems somewhere in between math/science and science fiction in terms of necessity/inevitability and interchangeability of the human parts in epochal events. 🤔

      3 replies 1 retweet 22 likes
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    7. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 28
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      I’m getting the sense that Astounding/Unknown under Campbell were like the blogosphere in the aughts and 10s. Though only a few names like Asimov and Heinlein got big, dozens were experimenting and creating sci-fi conventions and tropes. A kind of Silicon Valley of genre fiction.

      2 replies 3 retweets 21 likes
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    8. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 28
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      Another thing. Nuclear technology was clearly the biggest thing shaping the imagination of this crowd. Space was just the backdrop. Computers and robots were mostly props. But nukes: as central then as climate change today. Golden age sci-fi was very much an atomic age genre.

      2 replies 2 retweets 30 likes
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    9. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 28
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      And Heinlein’s competent man trope was the tip of an iceberg. This era appears to clung desperately to the idea of absolute mastery of increasingly inscrutable tech. And we’re not even to the 40s yet.

      1 reply 1 retweet 20 likes
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    10. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 28
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      Campbell was basically a one-man human internet of sci-fi, a sort of Mycroft Holmes figure, routing ideas, provocations, etc to their correct destinations and absorbing all the nest output. He *was* the market. Intercessionary figure bridging to fandom.

      1 reply 3 retweets 22 likes
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      Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 28
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      Heh, Asimov started avoiding aliens and went with robots because he didn’t like Campbell’s militaristic edits based on humans being superior to aliens. Interesting.

      11:53 PM - 28 Feb 2020
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      2 replies 2 retweets 28 likes
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        2. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          Alright, we’re back to live tweeting my reading. Now into WW2. Heinlein is getting jingoistic, Asimov got married and is getting confident and snapping bra straps, Hubbard has messed up his navy career. Campbell is still with the magazines unable to find a role in war effort.

          1 reply 0 retweets 9 likes
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        3. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          Heinlein and Asimov work at the same place in the war effort, with Heinlein as superior. Clash of wills. The nerdy, awkward, deferential but strong-willed Asimov (22?) is slowly asserting himself against dominance of the 12-years older Heinlein (34?), a charismatic asshole.

          2 replies 1 retweet 8 likes
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        4. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          Ironic choice of words in last tweet. Looks like Heinlein had painful hemorrhoids and surgery for it etc. Wife turning into an alcoholic under stress of getting sister and kids back from Philippines interment. Just cause for assholery I guess.

          3 replies 0 retweets 6 likes
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        5. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          All but Asimov are trying to live up to the competent man trope they’ve mythologized in SF culture and kinda failing. A tale of 3 slow trainwrecks and one bright young kid watching and learning.

          1 reply 1 retweet 10 likes
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        6. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          Hubbard is coming across in this telling as at once the biggest liar and scammer and the only one not drinking the competent man kool-aid. This is a story of 3 hypocrites and one narcissistic sociopath.

          1 reply 1 retweet 6 likes
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        7. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          One thing I can relate to is Campbell’s constant struggle to find steady, quality contributors through the war. Despite his ability to pay top dollar and the fact that his supply was mostly physically unfit-for-duty types. Only a rare few could do what he wanted.

          1 reply 2 retweets 8 likes
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        8. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          What he wanted was people who could take his prompts and deliver creative results different and better than what he himself might have produced. A sort of laissez faire writers market with campbellian monopsonic characteristics. He wanted to send grand strategy. Much schwerpunkt.

          2 replies 2 retweets 15 likes
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        9. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          Campbell badly wanted sci-fi to be relevant to the war and got investigated and a slap on the wrist for running a story speculating too close to the Manhattan project. He did it on purpose to get exactly such a response. Ultimately all he got to do was produce sonar manuals.

          2 replies 3 retweets 12 likes
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        10. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          It’s weird reading about this failed attempt at relevance in parallel with actual accounts of wartime R&D. Sci-fi as the insecure fanboy of the real thing, trying to Mary Sue itself into the real thing. Much fractal, so irony.

          1 reply 1 retweet 19 likes
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        11. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          Oddly this desire for relevance has never been any part of my own motivation for sci-fi experiments. My intentions are pure escapist self-indulgence.

          1 reply 0 retweets 6 likes
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        12. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          But I guess in 1942, science and science fiction still seemed like vaguely comparable human activities at the same level, kinda like programming vs using the internet did in the 90s.

          3 replies 1 retweet 16 likes
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        13. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          I hope there’s a similar book available for the counterculture era... PKD/Le Guin etc. And one for Jules Verne to Amazing era. Why is there no proper Big History of all of science fiction? Or is there. It seems like a manageable project. About the size of a Caro book.

          5 replies 1 retweet 16 likes
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        14. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          The difference between good genre fiction and literary fiction is quantity over quality. You have to read a vast amount and absorb the intellectual currents across the aggregate. If you just read a couple you won’t get the appeal. If you read a few dozen from a period, you will.

          1 reply 3 retweets 11 likes
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        15. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          I’ve read almost all of Asimov and Clarke, and samples of most in the top 10-15 I think. Taken as a whole, the genre is a sort of fandom of technological civilization. It’s own fandom is 2nd order. This book captures that spirit.

          1 reply 2 retweets 19 likes
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        16. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          Lol apparently upsetting the Seldon plan was Campbell’s idea and initially Asimov didn’t want to do it. The result was the Mule, probably the most interesting episode in the series.

          3 replies 1 retweet 22 likes
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        17. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          Campbell was a tactical humbug, pulling PR stunts to position himself and science fiction in the post-war mythology. Some sort of greater good/creating what we would today call transhumans type mission. Reminds me a bit of Elon Musk, the way he appears to have pwned the plot.

          1 reply 1 retweet 10 likes
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        18. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          Looks like Hubbard wanted glory for himself, while Campbell wanted it for the greater glory of science fiction and the role he thought it ought to play in society. Both succeeded. Hubbard created a self-aggrandizing religion. Campbell faked it so future sci-if could make it.

          2 replies 1 retweet 6 likes
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        19. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          Haha nice stuntpic.twitter.com/Lr6Z2xml2h

          2 replies 1 retweet 9 likes
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        20. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Feb 29
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          “Cybernetics is the big new idea of the times, and it is my opinion Hubbard...has got cybernetics, and got it bad; this is to say, he has got it wrong” — Yvette Gittleson, American Scientist, 1950 Wiener strikes again. The 40s/50s apparently just contained like 10 people

          2 replies 2 retweets 17 likes
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        21. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Mar 1
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          Current ranking of who I want to model my Act 2 after. I’m 2-15 older than any of them at the point in the story (1950) they’re at right now. Campbell (1910, 40) Asimov (1920, 30) Heinlein (1907, 43) Hubbard (1911, 39) Similar fork in road though. Subculture —> mainstream leap

          2 replies 1 retweet 10 likes
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        22. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Mar 1
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          Might seem like a weird comparison, but it seems reasonable actually. At that point, pulp sci-fi was about as marginal a subculture as insight-porn blogosphere is today. These 4 were not famous then the way they are now. But by 1950 each had the option to go mainstream or go home

          2 replies 1 retweet 5 likes
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        23. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Mar 1
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          Unit economics sidebar. There’s an episode where Astounding tries to go up in quality from cheap digest to glossy “slicks” but fails to gain a foothold there, and goes back down to cheapie digest. Equivalent of serious blog trying to go magazine-scale in 2012 say.

          1 reply 1 retweet 2 likes
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        24. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Mar 1
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          Today we don’t realize this, but all print is not the same. Print saw its own Moore’s law type cost curve, with each gen creating a cheaper class of media if you could fit the rigid specs to make unit economics work for you. Pulp fiction got its name from wood-pulp cheap paper.

          2 replies 1 retweet 3 likes
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        25. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Mar 1
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          Think of pulp vs slick/glossy kinda like Wordpress blogs vs mainstream media websites built on bespoke web publishing stacks. Heinlein in 1950 trying to break out of astounding and into glossies is like blogger trying to get a New Yorker byline today.

          1 reply 1 retweet 7 likes
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        26. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Mar 1
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          So where are we now, circa 1950? Campbell is parlaying nuke-age attention on SF into mainstream influence Heinlein is using YA fiction to slingshot into mainstream, and trying to get foot into space program Hubbard has found cultish feet Asimov starting to flex Reading on...

          1 reply 0 retweets 4 likes
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        27. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Mar 1
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          On a darker note, all 4 have woman trouble. Campbell’s wife Dona has left him, Heinlein’s wife Leslyn is out as an alcoholic, Hubbard has hooked up with clingy 18 year old he now wants to dump, Asimov is a mildly frustrated newlywed turning into a low-intensity harasser.

          1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
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        28. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Mar 1
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          Still wrapping my head around the fact that letters to magazines = blog comments. Magazines printed addresses of letter writers so sliding into dms = writing to other fans. Early fan conferences *were* the basic Facebook groups and slacks. Not escalations from something else.

          3 replies 3 retweets 14 likes
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        29. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Mar 1
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          Magazines also ran reader polls like we do Twitter polls. The community dynamics, rivalries among different kinds of fan clubs etc all sound very, very familiar. We just do it all online now. It truly is astounding (heh!) all this rhymes with blogosphere of last decade.

          1 reply 0 retweets 7 likes
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        30. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Mar 1
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          To us all this sounds very heavyweight. But back then this *was* the lightest-weight, cheapest way to get anything done. Fans coordinated regional meetups and stuff through *postcards* not even phone! Stamp = 3c, postcard = SMS, letter = email Local phone call = 5c

          1 reply 0 retweets 5 likes
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        31. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr Mar 1
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          Imagine how you’d form a group then 1. Postcards to letter writers you “follow” 2. Exchange of letters 3. Bunch of postcards to invite people to regional meetup 4. Asimov might show up 5. Escalate to phone for locals you meet more often on short notice/impromptu

          1 reply 0 retweets 6 likes
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