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vgr's profile
Venkatesh Rao
Venkatesh Rao
Venkatesh Rao
@vgr

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Venkatesh Rao

@vgr

Conversational account. For work follow @ribbonfarm, @breaking_smart, @artofgig. Tweets are 90% vacuous views, apathetically held. Mediocritopian. IKEA builder.

Los Angeles, CA
venkateshrao.com
Joined August 2007

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    1. /ˈsɪsɪfəs/‏ @ExistentCitizen 16 Jul 2018
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      Is it possible that we misunderstand political control after all these years? Existential citizenship as necessary for meaningful political engagement http://bit.ly/2uEa9I8  @hopeCornellND @Skye_Cleary @Meaningness @PoliticalPhilo @vgr

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    2. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr 16 Jul 2018
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      Replying to @ExistentCitizen @hopeCornellND and

      In a past life I was a control theory researcher. Applied to politics it is largely seductive nonsense that explains very little. Look up spectacularly underwhelming history of system dynamics (Jay Forrester, Limits to Growth stuff). Wiener’s Cybernetics led to more woo than wow.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. /ˈsɪsɪfəs/‏ @ExistentCitizen 16 Jul 2018
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      Replying to @vgr @hopeCornellND and

      I thought you'd mentioned previous work in control theory, so I was curious re: your take. I can see how fine specification of control in complex systems would be problematic, if not impossible, but if there is actual control, it must be this way, no?

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    4. /ˈsɪsɪfəs/‏ @ExistentCitizen 16 Jul 2018
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      Replying to @ExistentCitizen @vgr and

      (i.e., if the proper components, functions, and relationships can be identified, isn't that sufficient? Otherwise, if control cannot even be specified at a general conceptual level, then what grounds are there to assert its presence at all?)

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    5. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr 16 Jul 2018
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      Replying to @ExistentCitizen @hopeCornellND and

      You may be confusing the descriptive modeling and synthesis sides of control. There’s always feedback loops in any natural system. Trivially and tautologically everything is a control system. You may or may not be able to acquire control authority that’s all.

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    6. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr 16 Jul 2018
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      Replying to @vgr @ExistentCitizen and

      Read Dictator’s Handbook. That’s close to the simplest possibly control theoretic model of politics. Could actually be coded up as a simulation.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. /ˈsɪsɪfəs/‏ @ExistentCitizen 16 Jul 2018
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      Replying to @vgr @hopeCornellND and

      Thanks for the recommendation. I'll take a look. (Also, my intuition is that most identifiable control relations will likely be trivial and tautological, as you say. That control is not specifiable in the most signficant situations, even conceptually, seems an interesting point.)

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr 16 Jul 2018
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      Replying to @ExistentCitizen @hopeCornellND and

      Didn’t say that. Much of smart politics is already smart controls theory. They just don’t need us to tell them that. A case of teaching birds to fly. You catching a ball is a simple ball_elevation_angle —> running_speed loop. But you don’t need control engineers to teach that

      11:05 PM - 16 Jul 2018
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        2. Venkatesh Rao‏ @vgr 16 Jul 2018
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          Replying to @vgr @ExistentCitizen and

          If you want to uncover control loops, relevant structures will be obvious, but meanings won’t be. For eg, gerrymandering = politicians choosing voters rather than other way around, disconnecting voting as feedback loop. Mesquita analyzes that the way a control theorist would.

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. /ˈsɪsɪfəs/‏ @ExistentCitizen 16 Jul 2018
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          Replying to @vgr @hopeCornellND and

          Agreed (esp. re: smart/lucky practitioners doing what works w/out much analysis). Still, a more analytical look also seems worthwhile, esp. w/reasonable framework (ala BdM). Just interested in what can be learned thru modeling control loops, esp. where control is assumed w/out ?

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. End of conversation

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