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tomdupresh's profile
I GUESS THEY NEVER MISS
I GUESS THEY NEVER MISS
I GUESS THEY NEVER MISS
@tomdupresh

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I GUESS THEY NEVER MISS

@tomdupresh

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London, England
medium.com/@tomdupre
Joined November 2015

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    1. Sunder Katwala‏ @sundersays May 20

      The "Heil Hipsters" (Make Fascism Chic Again) editorial presentation shows a remarkable degree of cognitive dissonance (& a lack of common sense) given that it comes from a media outlet which (rightly) warns of the need to be vigilant against anti-semitism.

      5 replies 23 retweets 84 likes
      Show this thread
    2. Sunder Katwala‏ @sundersays May 20

      "Generation Identity" will fail miserably in UK. Biggest reason is depth of UK intergenerational shift against racism. (Generational shifts in racism & support/toxicity of far right do appear q.significantly different in different European countries)http://www.britishfuture.org/articles/enoch-rivers-blood-ancient-history-britons-2018/ …

      2 replies 9 retweets 25 likes
      Show this thread
    3. I GUESS THEY NEVER MISS‏ @tomdupresh May 21
      Replying to @sundersays

      You’ve badly misread that article - it said most young people did not recognise a politician from the 60s, and included nothing about their views on immigration, simply asked do they know about a speech from 5 decades ago. Unsurprisingly, you had to be there...

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    4. Sunder Katwala‏ @sundersays May 21
      Replying to @tomdupresh

      You do not sound like you bothered to click to or read the linked research report "Many Rivers Crossed" which contains qualitative research from the West Midlands & national polling on precisely those points.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. I GUESS THEY NEVER MISS‏ @tomdupresh May 21
      Replying to @sundersays

      Sorry if I missed anything will read through later. Two points to be aware of though are that public opinion isn’t a monolith and often changes rapidly, and that if that generational trend does in fact exist here, it’s the exception in the developed world. France, Italy, etc

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. Sunder Katwala‏ @sundersays May 21
      Replying to @tomdupresh

      I'm struck by how v.little you seem to know about your own country. My tweet said you'd find this distinctly difficult in Britain for 2 reasons: depth of intergenerational shift in attitudes here differs *and* weakness of "European" as identity in UK, a narrow (liberal) segment

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. I GUESS THEY NEVER MISS‏ @tomdupresh May 21
      Replying to @sundersays

      I really question the idea of intergenerational shift as being real or relevant here. This is like all those young remain voters who couldn’t be bothered to show up - if you claim a group of people think something, they will often repeat the claim back to you

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. Sunder Katwala‏ @sundersays May 21
      Replying to @tomdupresh

      This seems to me puzzling: If UK GI claims to "explicitly denounce racism and racist language" (Sunday Times), why is it so important for you to challenge my claim of a "UK intergenerational shift against racism"? The evidence for the claim is strong but why is it a problem?

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. I GUESS THEY NEVER MISS‏ @tomdupresh May 21
      Replying to @sundersays

      Because racism tends to get worse in increasingly multicultural societies, rather than better. It is one of several negative side effects. I would also argue that while parts of RoB were ill-advised, Enoch Powell was not racist, and neither was the speech

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    10. Sunder Katwala‏ @sundersays May 21
      Replying to @tomdupresh

      You can find my view of Powell in 'Many Rivers Crossed' when you get round to it. But I am surprised to hear you find parts of it "ill advised" since your own argument sounds very similar indeed. Where do you think the speech did go too far and why?

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      I GUESS THEY NEVER MISS‏ @tomdupresh May 21
      Replying to @sundersays

      I think the line about whip hands, even if it was an 'anecdote', was inflammatory, and hasn't played out in reality, though some would say affirmative action style policies are similar. He underestimated the rate of demographic change however. Reading the article now, thanks.

      10:19 AM - 21 May 2018
      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Sunder Katwala‏ @sundersays May 23
          Replying to @tomdupresh

          Tour criticism of "whip hand" seems primarily that it was a tactical mis-step on tone. But Enoch said it for a substantive reason: the 1968 anti-discrimination bill was the occasion of his speech. Where are you on that? With 50 years hindsight, repeal the act or keep it?

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. I GUESS THEY NEVER MISS‏ @tomdupresh May 23
          Replying to @sundersays

          I don’t know much about the ‘68 act, but while it’s content may be unobjectionable but you have to admit a lot of what followed is ridiculous - all minority / women shortlists, the idea that all inequalities of outcome are due to conspiracy theories etc

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. Sunder Katwala‏ @sundersays May 23
          Replying to @tomdupresh

          I was a strong opponent of all-bme shortlists https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2008/03/minority-shortlists-british … I support the race relations act & the new disparity audit. It seems odd & v evasive that GI can not say whether you would keep or repeal the race relations act. The logic of your ideas is surely to repeal?

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        5. I GUESS THEY NEVER MISS‏ @tomdupresh May 23
          Replying to @sundersays

          I have never read the ‘68 act, if it is simply about legal restrictions on access to services as it seems then I support it

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        6. Sunder Katwala‏ @sundersays May 23
          Replying to @tomdupresh

          Enoch objected in principle to the state removing the liberty of an Englishman to discriminate (customers, employees, tenants) for any reasons of his own choice, such as a personal preference to have no inter-ethnic colleagues/contact in his business.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        7. End of conversation

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