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taviso's profile
Tavis Ormandy
Tavis Ormandy
Tavis Ormandy
Verified account
@taviso

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Tavis OrmandyVerified account

@taviso

Vulnerability researcher at Google. This is a personal stream, opinions expressed are mine.

California
taviso.decsystem.org
Joined April 2008

Tweets

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    1. Rich Felker‏ @RichFelker May 23
      • Report Tweet
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      Replying to @RichFelker @taviso and

      If a router vendor ships their source that's a modified OpenWRT, but doesn't do repro build processes, do you think it's likely that the source actually matches the firmware blob you download from their site? :-)

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    2. Tavis Ormandy‏Verified account @taviso May 23
      • Report Tweet
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      Replying to @RichFelker @matthew_d_green and

      Right, but you're saying "they might be breaking the law, and if they provide a reproducible build, we can check if they're breaking the law and sue them....." so, if they are breaking the law, why would they do that?

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    3. Rich Felker‏ @RichFelker May 23
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      Replying to @taviso @matthew_d_green and

      No. I'm saying that you can check that there's not new vendor-induced bug surface outside the patch set and limit the scope of what needs audit to the patch set.

      1 reply 0 retweets 4 likes
    4. Tavis Ormandy‏Verified account @taviso May 23
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      Replying to @RichFelker @matthew_d_green and

      I deleted my last tweet, I think I misunderstood. I think you're saying there are code quality benefits to making your build reproducible, and you want developers to be better. OK, but you're mixing in security claims, I only really object to claims it prevents backdoors.

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    5. Rich Felker‏ @RichFelker May 23
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      Replying to @taviso @matthew_d_green and

      Not just code quality but, when the product is derived from FOSS and you don't have reason to believe the vendor has ability to upstream bugdoors into the FOSS, significant benefits to the practicality of audit for bugdoors and unintentional added vulns.

      2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
    6. Tavis Ormandy‏Verified account @taviso May 23
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      Replying to @RichFelker @matthew_d_green and

      Sure, and I want a pony. Nobody is going to buy me one though, so why discuss it? 😛

      6 replies 0 retweets 13 likes
    7. Marcus Müller‏ @dEnergy_dTime May 23
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      Replying to @taviso @RichFelker and

      honestly, this is all a large log of whataboutisms. Sure, there's bugdoors. Ssource code are still easier to audit for bugs than binaries. If you don't have reproducible builds, you are left with the binary alone. So, I see a benefit. Complete solution? Nothing ever is.

      1 reply 0 retweets 7 likes
    8. Tavis Ormandy‏Verified account @taviso May 25
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      Replying to @dEnergy_dTime @RichFelker and

      Obviously you can have source code without reproducible builds, what a ridiculous thing to say?

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. Rich Felker‏ @RichFelker May 25
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      Replying to @taviso @dEnergy_dTime and

      In practice you *don't* have source code without repro builds. You have approximate source code that differs from the actual source the binary was built from in various ways for various reasons.

      2 replies 0 retweets 4 likes
    10. Leif Ryge‏ @wiretapped May 26
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      Replying to @RichFelker @taviso and

      pic.twitter.com/Bd6ARRKxbw

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
      Tavis Ormandy‏Verified account @taviso May 26
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      Replying to @wiretapped @RichFelker and

      First, you need to explain why you want to use that specific binary so badly? Here is what I do if I don't trust a binary: I compile the source code, and use that binary. What is the attack against this system, which works today, that you're trying to solve?

      9:10 AM - 26 May 2020
      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Leif Ryge‏ @wiretapped May 26
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          Replying to @taviso @RichFelker and

          it's solving the problem that very few people have sufficient resources to build all the binaries for all the software on all of their systems, so in practice nearly everyone must rely on lots of other people's build servers. without repro builds, every build server is a SPOF.

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Leif Ryge‏ @wiretapped May 26
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          Replying to @wiretapped @taviso and

          also, for organizations who do have sufficient resources (i.e. companies like your employer) it gives them the opportunity to make it much more difficult for a bad actor to compromise their own builds (even for internal and/or proprietary builds, potentially)

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. 13 more replies

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