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taviso's profile
Tavis Ormandy
Tavis Ormandy
Tavis Ormandy
Verified account
@taviso

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Tavis OrmandyVerified account

@taviso

Vulnerability researcher at Google. This is a personal stream, opinions expressed are mine.

California
taviso.decsystem.org
Joined April 2008

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    1. Marcus Müller‏ @dEnergy_dTime May 25
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      Replying to @taviso @RichFelker and

      1/some, until I say done. So, you wonder "hey, this Signal app seems to be secure. Can I really trust it with my company's secrets, though? I know I trust Google to run their App Store (otherwise, my android phone can't be trusted at all), but how do I know that the software

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    2. Marcus Müller‏ @dEnergy_dTime May 25
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      Replying to @dEnergy_dTime @taviso and

      actually lives up to the standards it proclaims it has?" So, you turn to someone from the field you trust: Matthew. You read through his website, and he describes his audit of the signal source code (and build system). That's nice, you say, so Matthew knows that the code he

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. Marcus Müller‏ @dEnergy_dTime May 25
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      Replying to @dEnergy_dTime @taviso and

      read is fine. But that says little about the binary you'll download, you say, because who guarantees that Signal (the company) gave Matthew the code that leads to the binary that they uploaded to Google's app store? Now, you read on, and Matthew says: here, I've built the APK

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    4. Marcus Müller‏ @dEnergy_dTime May 25
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      Replying to @dEnergy_dTime @taviso and

      from source. That's a relief to you, because it means you don't have to do so, which would be hard, because your machines are busy fuzzing Windows APIs or whatever you're up to these days! Now the thing is, while you are technically capable, you have absolutely no interest in

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    5. Marcus Müller‏ @dEnergy_dTime May 25
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      Replying to @dEnergy_dTime @taviso and

      your mom and your boss downloading an APK from a website, and guiding them through allowing software installation from firefox on Android. Not only because that's tedious, but also because that's counter-productive in security terms So, instead you read further: You read that,

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    6. Marcus Müller‏ @dEnergy_dTime May 25
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      Replying to @dEnergy_dTime @taviso and

      because Signal took care that their build system always produced exactly the same binary, Matthew was able to check that the version uploaded to Play Store is exactly the same as the version he built from the source code he audited. Now you're convinced: you will tell your boss,

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    7. Marcus Müller‏ @dEnergy_dTime May 25
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      Replying to @dEnergy_dTime @taviso and

      even your mom that as long as they install the version 1.2.3. of Signal from Google, they get something that is at the very least source code-level audited. In fact, you never even had to have source code for that - Matthew could have, instead of Signal, just as well audited

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    8. Marcus Müller‏ @dEnergy_dTime May 25
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      Replying to @dEnergy_dTime @taviso and

      the Microsoft Word app, or Pokemon Go. As long as you trust Matthew that HE has read the source code and he was able to verify the binary he's built matches the one on Play Store, you're fine. Done!

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. Tavis Ormandy‏Verified account @taviso May 25
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      Replying to @dEnergy_dTime @RichFelker and

      Here is how to do it without reproducible builds: Matthew builds the binary he's audited, uploads it to the play store, then you download it. Works today, doesn't require any reproducible builds, doesn't require disabling updates. Done!

      3 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    10. Rich Felker‏ @RichFelker May 25
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      Replying to @taviso @dEnergy_dTime and

      Rich Felker Retweeted Rich Felker

      Then Matthew has to take responsibility of being a distributor, and possibly being blamed as the one responsible for a bugdoor if it's present in his build. Matthew almost certainly does not want either of these things. See also:https://twitter.com/RichFelker/status/1264999387517923328 …

      Rich Felker added,

      Rich Felker @RichFelker
      Replying to @taviso @dEnergy_dTime and 8 others
      Trusting X to be competent and not to be conspiring with Y is not the same as trusting X to provide you binaries.
      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Tavis Ormandy‏Verified account @taviso May 25
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      Replying to @RichFelker @dEnergy_dTime and

      In your opinion, if openssl is bugdoored, will Debian be blamed? I've audited openssl and found some bugs, will I be blamed if I missed some?

      2:15 PM - 25 May 2020
      • 2 Likes
      • Yanai Moyal
      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Rich Felker‏ @RichFelker May 25
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          Replying to @taviso @dEnergy_dTime and

          It was and they were. 😂 CVE-2008-0166

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Rich Felker‏ @RichFelker May 25
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          Replying to @RichFelker @taviso and

          Jokes aside, maybe. Probably not if there's a good audit trail of the source and how it happened. But what if Matthew had a compromised box he built from? Does he want to risk making binary releases vulnerable people are expected to trust?

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
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