Okay let me say it a last time in a simple thread so that people can be pointed to it and I don't have to repeat myself. 1) I think that we have not enough women talking at cons. 2) I have seen many times (and heard from other con organizers) that only a few submit to cons.
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there are many theories why this happens. From less desire to speak, less confidence, fear of toxic environment or likely other theories. 3) There might be cons who cannot understand that because they have many submissions.
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4) I believe we have to encourage them to submit. The optimum would be they just submit to CFPs without additional encouraging. 5) I do not believe that any gender is more or less qualified to talk. It is a personal thing that depends on each individual.
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6) I have absolutely no problem with women being selected more often than what their submission rate would suggest if selected by a random number generator.
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7) The problem arises when a con "pledges even before the CFP" that they will have more women. You cannot pledge this without openly admitting that you will select based on gender.
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Replying to @i0n1c
So your argument boils down to saying pledging in advance is a sort of “affirmative action”? And do you then have any opinions about that — my guess is that you’re against affirmative action systems? Just asking to clarify...
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Tavis Ormandy Retweeted Tavis Ormandy
I think he has just made the logical error of assuming that if a speaker lineup is not population representative, then the review bar must have been lowered. I think this is a very common fallacy.https://twitter.com/taviso/status/1097524484200849409 …
Tavis Ormandy added,
Tavis OrmandyVerified account @tavisoReplying to @i0n1cI think it's a fallacy that "the bar must have been lowered", you can encourage more submissions from less represented groups and then the percentage of good submissions from that group increases. Doesn't that explain a non-population representative lineup w/o requiring quotas?1 reply 1 retweet 11 likes -
Well but if like
@aionescu says you have to meet a quota no matter what this means you lowered the bar - unless you have an endless source of high quality submissions from a minority.3 replies 0 retweets 1 like
There are more than enough qualified people from just about any group to fill any number of slots.
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I don’t think that degree of hyperbole is useful. Two examples that spring to mind are HITB and Kiwicon. Both have exceptional technical standards and both very, very serious about inclusion. They don’t pull 50-50 numbers, but I bet they’d like to.
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Controlling for ‘women into RE who could make it to the Ruhr/Luxembourg for a weekend,’
@Blackhoodie_RE still managed mini-cons I’d have been happy to pay for (think I’m with Tavis)1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes - 2 more replies
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