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taviso's profile
Tavis Ormandy
Tavis Ormandy
Tavis Ormandy
Verified account
@taviso

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Tavis OrmandyVerified account

@taviso

Vulnerability researcher at Google. This is a personal stream, opinions expressed are mine.

California
taviso.decsystem.org
Joined April 2008

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    1. Per Thorsheim‏Verified account @thorsheim 19 Dec 2018
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      Replying to @taviso @zoresvit @evilproffy

      «It opens some cans, so at least you get something, which is better than nothing?» A Google Titan Key doesn’t solve phishing, it makes it harder because as an attacker I will probably need to get hold of the physical key. «Hi, I’m from corporate IT. I have a new key for you.»

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    2. Tavis Ormandy‏Verified account @taviso 19 Dec 2018
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      Replying to @thorsheim @zoresvit @evilproffy

      Umm, If you can't use phishing and have to use a non-phishing attack, then you've solved phishing. You understand that you can defeat SMS 2FA with phishing? I'm confused about your point.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    3. Tavis Ormandy‏Verified account @taviso 19 Dec 2018
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      Replying to @taviso @thorsheim and

      "[U2F] doesn’t solve phishing [..] because an attacker [can] get the physical key" is just wrong. That *is* solving phishing. I think you're falling into the trap of false equivalency, like antibiotics aren't perfect and neither is homeopathy, so does it matter which one you use?

      1 reply 0 retweets 9 likes
    4. Per Thorsheim‏Verified account @thorsheim 19 Dec 2018
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      Replying to @taviso @zoresvit @evilproffy

      Ah. Phishing to me is not just digital, it is simply "tricking people", no matter physical or digital. WebAuthn solves a lot and I like it, but the human problem remains unsolved. Google employees knows not to hand out their Titan key. Most people do not.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. Tavis Ormandy‏Verified account @taviso 19 Dec 2018
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      Replying to @thorsheim @zoresvit @evilproffy

      That is a very unusual usage of phishing, I think most people would use "social engineering". Regarding your attack of handing it to a stranger, I would recommend giving it to them. They are willing to break the law, and are physically nearby. They can assault you if you refuse.

      1 reply 0 retweets 5 likes
    6. Tavis Ormandy‏Verified account @taviso 19 Dec 2018
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      Replying to @taviso @thorsheim and

      Hand over the device, and contact your system administrator and the police when you are safe.

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    7. Per Thorsheim‏Verified account @thorsheim 19 Dec 2018
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      Replying to @taviso @zoresvit @evilproffy

      Sounds close to the concerns from @schneierblog many years ago regarding biometrics: kind of hard to give away, may result in increased danger to the user/owner if facing a determined attacker. But can an attacker in any way get multiple hw keys attached to the same account?

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. Per Thorsheim‏Verified account @thorsheim 19 Dec 2018
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      Replying to @thorsheim @taviso and

      Sort of fun to ask TouchID / FaceID users if they have EVER checked to see if additional prints have been added to their phone. Who would check to see if additional hw keys have been added to an account? Does Google in any way tell me if it happened?

      2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
    9. Ruslan Kiyanchuk‏ @zoresvit 19 Dec 2018
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      Replying to @thorsheim @taviso and

      Google can't know about it because fingerprint information doesn't leave the device. Also, if you can add fingerprints, then you already know the passcode which allows you to bypass TouchID, so I don't see why would anyone bother with fingerprints.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    10. Per Thorsheim‏Verified account @thorsheim 19 Dec 2018
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      Replying to @zoresvit @taviso and

      If I could add my fingerprints or face to your phone, I've got access even after you change your pin/pwd. Would you check to see if additional prints had been added somehow?

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Tavis Ormandy‏Verified account @taviso 19 Dec 2018
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      Replying to @thorsheim @zoresvit and

      You could also just hit me with a brick until I give you whatever data you wanted. I think we should differentiate between phishing, social engineering, and attacks that require physical proximity. You're the only person I've ever talked to who groups them all together 😛

      10:44 AM - 19 Dec 2018
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      • Stay HOME! #FlattenTheCurve KP Jan Roger Wilkens Noah Richards Matt Denton Chris 🌈🌟 Christopher McNeil 🇨🇦 Carroll
      0 replies 0 retweets 8 likes
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        2. Ruslan Kiyanchuk‏ @zoresvit 19 Dec 2018
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          Replying to @taviso @thorsheim and

          I'd argue about not having a solution for physically nearby attackers: private security agencies? We can only build constructive security measures within a certain threat model with risk analysis.

          3 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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