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taviso's profile
Tavis Ormandy
Tavis Ormandy
Tavis Ormandy
Verified account
@taviso

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Tavis OrmandyVerified account

@taviso

Vulnerability researcher at Google. This is a personal stream, opinions expressed are mine.

California
taviso.decsystem.org
Joined April 2008

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    1. The Dave!  😣‏ @TheDaveCA 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @pati_gallardo @taviso

      I haven’t previously contributed to this discussion, but I’m scratching my head trying to understand how kernel memory corruption causes a device to not boot. Plenty of others have asked, but I don’t see an answer anywhere. Sounds like a bigger bug at work?

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    2. Tavis Ormandy‏Verified account @taviso 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @TheDaveCA @pati_gallardo

      There is no bigger bug than remote kernel memory corruption, that is effectively game over. I think the disconnect here is that you're assuming "bricking" is higher severity and are confused why it's not called out as a possibility, but that's not the case.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    3. Tavis Ormandy‏Verified account @taviso 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @taviso @TheDaveCA @pati_gallardo

      You could use a kernel RCE to brick a phone, but that would be like spending $100k on a prank, most people would just give you their phone for half of that, so why would do that? We envision govs developing attacks to spy on dissidents, not pranking their friends.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    4. The Dave!  😣‏ @TheDaveCA 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @taviso @pati_gallardo

      I understand the risks of a kernel RCE. But what happened when she did her demo to help the engineers reproduce? Did they reboot their phones using the magic button sequences to force a hardware reboot? Or were their devices damaged beyond a reboot?

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. Tavis Ormandy‏Verified account @taviso 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @TheDaveCA @pati_gallardo

      Required DFU restore. Honestly, it's odd to say "did they reboot their phone" after I said bricked, it sounds like you're probing to catch me out.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. The Dave!  😣‏ @TheDaveCA 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @taviso @pati_gallardo

      Not at all, I just wonder whether DFU was enough, or bricked to the point that not even that was possible. I read chunks of the thread and didn’t see an answer, although also possible I missed it. Basically curious: Could I fix this myself or would I need Apple.

      0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. The Dave!  😣‏ @TheDaveCA 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @taviso @pati_gallardo

      Oh absolutely. But a RCE that invariably results in a bricked device within seconds would arguably be less dangerous than one that could be exploited undetectably.

      3 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. Tavis Ormandy‏Verified account @taviso 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @TheDaveCA @pati_gallardo

      If a vulnerability invariable results in a bricked device, that is not an RCE, right? That would be a remote DoS. The difference is that DoS is a subset of what you can do with an RCE (although why you would do that, I don't know).

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    9. The Dave!  😣‏ @TheDaveCA 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @taviso @pati_gallardo

      Maybe that’s part of the confusion? In the demo it was used as a DoS, I think? Did she need to brick the devices or could she have just displayed a picture of a brick on the screen (as a nod to ancient jailbreaking history)?

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      Tavis Ormandy‏Verified account @taviso 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @TheDaveCA @pati_gallardo

      Your question is very confusing, nevertheless I will try to answer it. Yes, in theory she could have developed an exploit and made a payload that displayed a picture of a brick (?).

      8:26 AM - 7 Nov 2018
      • 7 Likes
      • rm Mallory Moore Civility0 - r00t folding team #258829 William Jardine Michael Blake Whiskey Pete's *Closed for Shelter in Place* 𝔅𝔦𝔤𝔤𝔦𝔢 𝔖𝔪𝔞𝔩𝔩𝔰
      1 reply 0 retweets 7 likes
        1. Bitterman‏ @Bitterman59 7 Nov 2018
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          Replying to @taviso @TheDaveCA @pati_gallardo

          I regret I have but one brick picture to contribute.pic.twitter.com/AaeuzvRrWj

          0 replies 0 retweets 6 likes
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