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solardiz's profile
Solar Designer
Solar Designer
Solar Designer
@solardiz

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Solar Designer

@solardiz

@Openwall founder. RTs don't imply agreement with points of view.

openwall.com
Joined August 2012

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    1. Florian Harwöck‏ @harwoeck Aug 15

      I just published “Password and Credential Management in 2018 🔒”https://medium.com/p/password-and-credential-management-in-2018-56f43669d588 …

      1 reply 30 retweets 41 likes
    2. Solar Designer‏ @solardiz Aug 17
      Replying to @harwoeck

      I like what you write, but I also have criticism: You give several valid reasons for the domain-personalized client-side pre-hashing, however this may sound like it provides the equivalent of unique passwords even when actual passwords are reused, which it doesn't.

      2 replies 0 retweets 4 likes
    3. Solar Designer‏ @solardiz Aug 17
      Replying to @solardiz @harwoeck

      Not criticism: BTW, you actually can enforce a trivial password policy - a blacklist of top N otherwise-most-common and/or leaked passwords - even with this pre-hashing, by similarly pre-hashing that blacklist. A Bloom filter can make the check very fast even for huge blacklists.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
      Solar Designer‏ @solardiz Aug 17
      Replying to @solardiz @harwoeck

      Then, you suggest normalizing with SHA3-512 to 64 arbitrary bytes, yet at the same time mention bcrypt's truncation at first NUL. For passing into bcrypt (or another function accepting C string), you need to e.g. hex-encode HMAC-SHA256 (giving 64 ASCII chars, which fits in 72).

      11:45 AM - 17 Aug 2018
      • 1 Like
      • Florian Harwöck
      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        1. New conversation
        2. Solar Designer‏ @solardiz Aug 17
          Replying to @solardiz @harwoeck

          No reason to prefer SHA-3, but a reason to have something like HMAC in there is to avoid the ambiguity in e.g. "passwor" + "domain" vs. "password" + "omain". BTW, bcrypt was introduced in 1997 (code already in use), not 1999 (paper published).

          2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        3. Florian Harwöck‏ @harwoeck Aug 17
          Replying to @solardiz

          I'm not sure if I understand your example. Could you explain that a little bit more? Thanks 🙂 Regarding SHA3 and HMAC: I had a short discussion in Reddit about using KMAC instead of SHA3, but dropped the thought, as I have never used it and therefore won't recommend it to others

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. Solar Designer‏ @solardiz Aug 17
          Replying to @harwoeck

          The example shows that concatenating two variable-length strings can produce a collision. I also wouldn't recommend KMAC. My recommendation of HMAC-SHA256 is because it's widespread. It's especially good fit for use with yescrypt, which includes it in the tree anyway.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        5. Solar Designer‏ @solardiz Aug 17
          Replying to @solardiz @harwoeck

          BTW, you would need to do this pre-hashing server-side for the relatively few clients that lack client-side computation (JavaScript disabled, e.g. like it often is in Tor Browser).

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        6. End of conversation

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