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slightlylate's profile
Alex Russell
Alex Russell
Alex Russell
@slightlylate

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Alex Russell

@slightlylate

Chrome Project 🐡 & Web Standards TL; Blink API OWNER Named PWAs w/ @phae; probably making her ☕ DMs open. Tweets my own; press@google.com for official comms.

San Francisco, The Internet
infrequently.org
Joined December 2010

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    1. Shane O'Sullivan‏ @chofter Apr 19
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      Replying to @slightlylate @TaelurAlexis

      Now Alex, you know this is not accurate, even in this thread we see that - Gatsby supports no-JS - NextJS will soon support no JS & better progressive loading of JS - The React core team are building Suspense to improve things further. Best to avoid absolute statements

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    2. Alex Russell‏ @slightlylate Apr 19
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      Replying to @chofter @TaelurAlexis

      If what you're saying is "there is potential that this ship could turn", I agree! And I've agreed at every single moment from when I got so frustrated that I had to give a talk like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bZvq3nodf4 … ...and still, failure rates of React sites have not decreased.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. Shane O'Sullivan‏ @chofter Apr 19
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      Replying to @slightlylate @TaelurAlexis

      What do you say to the proposal that browser vendors do an inventory of the most common components in open source (pick, say, 10) and build them into the platform? Obviate the need for frameworks for 90% of use cases. Multi select, simple charts etc

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    4. Alex Russell‏ @slightlylate Apr 19
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      Replying to @chofter @TaelurAlexis

      I am a fan of extending the platform to integrate userland needs....but this has also been my biggest professional failure: I helped push classes, promisies, and other improvements over the line only to see developers (*cough* React *cough*) care more for OldIE than users

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. Shane O'Sullivan‏ @chofter Apr 19
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      Replying to @slightlylate @TaelurAlexis

      Is anyone driving this? What end user facing component has been added in the last 10 years? Why do custom date pickers even exist?I just hand built yet another multi select component, & don’t get me started on dynamic lists again.... Can we aim for 5 new components a year?

      3 replies 0 retweets 4 likes
    6. вкαя∂εℓℓ‏ @briankardell Apr 20
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      Replying to @chofter @slightlylate @TaelurAlexis

      I need to write about this, I guess, because this keeps coming up but in short words: I think no. This assumes that the view from the outside about how long any of this takes is accurate - it isn't. @gregwhitworth @stubbornella

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. вкαя∂εℓℓ‏ @briankardell Apr 20
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      Replying to @briankardell @chofter and

      The past is full of challenges that are different and dysfunction and so on, it isn't a real limit but it is illuminating and helpful in understanding the realities. I talk about this some on https://thewebplatformpodcast.com/195-platforms-and-priorities … andhttps://shoptalkshow.com/407 

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. вкαя∂εℓℓ‏ @briankardell Apr 20
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      Replying to @briankardell @chofter and

      but we can get things in the queue, and do better work via web components to figure this stuff out in a way that is far better aligned with real world economics if you want developer involvement (we do!). Getting things moving (people are trying) will keep mature things coming.

      1 reply 1 retweet 3 likes
    9. Alex Russell‏ @slightlylate Apr 20
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      Replying to @briankardell @chofter and

      I think we could absolutely shoot for a few components a year, and there's no better time than now to start! That said, I'm also not optimistic that it will make a dent on the universe. My experience of tracing sites suggests that the primary effect of ES6 was polyfill bloat.

      3 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    10. Shane O'Sullivan‏ @chofter Apr 20
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      Replying to @slightlylate @briankardell and

      We don’t have to choose one or the other. If we can solve the problem of form inputs being stuck in the 90s then a huge number of mobile sites simply won’t need frameworks any more, just some even handlers and fetch() calls

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
      Alex Russell‏ @slightlylate Apr 20
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      Replying to @chofter @briankardell and

      That as the theory under which I helped design `fetch()`, ES6, WC, etc. etc. etc. I don't mean to be a wet blanket, but there is scant evidence that when an improved version becomes widely available it results in anything more than continued over-polyfilling.

      9:02 AM - 20 Apr 2020
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        1. Alex Russell‏ @slightlylate Apr 20
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          Replying to @slightlylate @chofter and

          *some* tools do a good job of this! The most heavily used tools do not, which makes sense when you consider over-polyfilling as a DX matter: by insulating you in it, you don't have to think about what to include when. And so we overpolyfill/overtranspile pervasively.

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        2. вкαя∂εℓℓ‏ @briankardell Apr 20
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          Replying to @slightlylate @chofter and

          this seems the real nature of the problem tho @slightlylate, as I have argued before. If there was one thing we could do which would make a huge difference it would be to make that story better. It is unfortunately v hard.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Alex Russell‏ @slightlylate Apr 20
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          Replying to @briankardell @chofter and

          Indeed. It's going to require browsers (and others) to be better agents for the user and help create back-pressure to avoid too much code. That isn't the direction of travel, I'm afraid.

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
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