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slightlylate's profile
Alex Russell
Alex Russell
Alex Russell
@slightlylate

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Alex Russell

@slightlylate

Chrome Project 🐡 & Web Standards TL; Blink API OWNER Named PWAs w/ @phae; probably making her ☕ DMs open. Tweets my own; press@google.com for official comms.

San Francisco, The Internet
infrequently.org
Joined December 2010

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    1. Alex Russell‏ @slightlylate 15 Apr 2019
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      Replying to @slightlylate @_zouhir and

      Hard to navigate, requires lots of high-precision movement to use well, scales to other form factors terribly. OS consistency, at the limit, is only as good as the OS paradigms, and they are often cast in amber while software marches forward.

      1 reply 1 retweet 6 likes
    2. Alex Russell‏ @slightlylate 15 Apr 2019
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      Replying to @slightlylate @_zouhir and

      So the web should both reject slavish OS consistency (how much pain have we caused for <button> styling to defend this turf?) as well as the notion that browser provided impls are hallowed. They're just (badly layered) code that happens to be cheap.

      1 reply 1 retweet 6 likes
    3. Alex Russell‏ @slightlylate 15 Apr 2019
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      Replying to @slightlylate @_zouhir and

      The real calling is to expose the guts: make all the infra that browsers ship for themselves but not for developers available on equal footing. Open the damned thing up

      2 replies 1 retweet 8 likes
    4. Alex Russell‏ @slightlylate 15 Apr 2019
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      Replying to @slightlylate @_zouhir and

      The benefit here, in case it isn't clear, is to undercut the usual arguments against customisation (which are real): that userspace components are bad at a11y, heavyweight, etc. They don't *have* to be, but we force that by keeping <input> a welded-shut disaster

      1 reply 1 retweet 5 likes
    5. Greg Whitworth‏ @gregwhitworth 15 Apr 2019
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      Replying to @slightlylate @_zouhir @domenic

      agreed - I have a high level doc that goes over this. We're assessing the overall impact and team priorities at the moment, but if we do decide to tackle this I'd value your input. And yes, the story on the web for controls currently sucks, but it doesn't have to :)

      2 replies 1 retweet 2 likes
    6. Dave Rupert‏ @davatron5000 15 Apr 2019
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      Replying to @gregwhitworth @slightlylate and

      Developer and User Needs: <tabs> element <accordion> element <dialog> element (but good) <tooltip> element <input type="toggle">

      2 replies 0 retweets 13 likes
    7. Alex Russell‏ @slightlylate 15 Apr 2019
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      Replying to @davatron5000 @gregwhitworth and

      Have you written up what's not working with <dialog> somewhere?

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    8. Eric Bailey‏ @ericwbailey 15 Apr 2019
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      Replying to @slightlylate @davatron5000 and

      @scottohara has a good writeup here: https://www.scottohara.me/blog/2019/03/05/open-dialog.html …

      1 reply 0 retweets 4 likes
    9. Alex Russell‏ @slightlylate 15 Apr 2019
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      Replying to @ericwbailey @davatron5000 and

      Some of this sounds fixable by impls, some of it is JAWS/NVDA/TalkBack needing to improve (as the VoiceOver test shows), and most of it is down to other browsers just not implementing. Do I have that right?

      2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
    10. Eric Bailey‏ @ericwbailey 15 Apr 2019
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      Replying to @slightlylate @davatron5000 and

      My take is browser implementers didn't uphold their end of the bargain, and AT trying to figure out to best respond to varying, half-baked support.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
      Alex Russell‏ @slightlylate 15 Apr 2019
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      Replying to @ericwbailey @davatron5000 and

      Huh? If VoiceOver can use our AT tree to read out the right stuff, so can other a11y tools. Maybe @sundress knows more?

      1:47 PM - 15 Apr 2019
      • 1 Like
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      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
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        2. Scott O'MG‏ @scottohara 15 Apr 2019
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          Replying to @slightlylate @ericwbailey and

          VoiceOver "reads out the right stuff" is relative to the situation. certain content is completely ignored if the nesting levels go to deep (e.g. lists) none of the semantics of the content is announced, and depending on the length of the content is can be far too much to take in

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        3. Scott O'MG‏ @scottohara 15 Apr 2019
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          Replying to @scottohara @slightlylate and

          Scott O'MG Retweeted Steve Faulkner

          that said, i agree with your original statement that there are issues that implementation, and AT both need to work through here. Though @stevefaulkner's tweet about the linked issue would be one way forward to smooth out some of these issues:https://twitter.com/stevefaulkner/status/1117853252333162496 …

          Scott O'MG added,

          Steve Faulkner @stevefaulkner
          Replying to @slightlylate @ericwbailey and 5 others
          There is an a11y/UX issue in the spec and chrome implementation that needs fixing: dialog initial focus https://github.com/whatwg/html/issues/1929 … not difficult to fix i believe, but opposition from gatekeepers
          2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
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