Jon Pretty

I would certainly encourage everyone to avoid answering impulsively. After being dragged into a conversation I didn't want to be in just over a week ago, I can recommend against impulsive answers.

But what would failure look like? A segregated community where people don't, can't or won't agree, where there's no pushback against mutual antagonism, and one where nobody actually cares about it any more because they've given up?

I still care about it because it's not the welcoming community I want to be a part of. There were huge efforts made to make functional programming more welcoming to newcomers, particularly minorities, and that's a value I want to uphold and encourage.

Right now, there seems to be a general lack of awareness about how offputting a community dominated by angry, middle-aged, white men looks. Sure, I'm all of those things too. But I'd like people to say least have some hope that it doesn't have to be this way.

What I don't understand is what you are expecting from libraries authors affected by the "aggressive marketing". They can be nice and fight marketing with facts but it gets tiring. Eventually they either give up or fight back. Both are bad but you can't blame authors.

Well, I don't think I or anyone else should be surprised when someone promotes or defends something they have devoted time and effort to. There's nothing surprising about Raúl defending against perceived criticism of Cats, or John pushing his own libraries and ideas.

To be fair, it's a bit surprising (ok maybe not entirely surprising, but certainly extenuating) to constantly push your own ideas at the expenses of others. It's entirely possible to promote something you have devoted time and effort to without bringing everything else down.

I think this is the crucial bit that upsets people (including myself) the most: just promote your stuff without declaring everything else as inferior and obsolete. This is the sane behavior most people in the Scala community already have and the few notable exceptions stand out.