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peidran's profile
Peter Abrahamsen
Peter Abrahamsen
Peter Abrahamsen
@peidran

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Peter Abrahamsen

@peidran

"My vegetable love should grow / Vaster than empires and more slow." http://pronoun.is/he?or=they 

Lying in State
Joined August 2009

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    1. Peter Abrahamsen‏ @peidran 7 Jan 2019
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      Replying to @mykola @mathpunk

      Thanks, if I saw this before I'd forgotten. It's nice to see how widely accepted many of these ideas are, nine years on. I'm also glad to see major software initiatives coming from people capable of talking about them philosophically.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    2. Peter Abrahamsen‏ @peidran 7 Jan 2019
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      Replying to @peidran @mykola @mathpunk

      One of the purposes of the thing I'm working on now is to find a viable model of computation that moves beyond the single point of view. Philosophically, relativistic and constructivist. Technically, exploring distributed computing and collaboratively constructed representations.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. myk is teetering‏ @mykola 7 Jan 2019
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      Replying to @peidran @mathpunk

      Oh gosh hello that’s sorta what I’m building too. CRDT deltas all the way down, any set of deltas can be reduced into a stateful snapshot (constructivist), different users can see different deltas so its relativistic.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    4. myk is teetering‏ @mykola 7 Jan 2019
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      Replying to @mykola @peidran @mathpunk

      This is still early but the pieces are taking shape. If any object can be decomposed into the processes that it's composed of, if those processes can be reified and 'owned', then everyone can have a local set of processes representing _their_ view of a given object, and share!

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. myk is teetering‏ @mykola 7 Jan 2019
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      Replying to @mykola @peidran @mathpunk

      But the sharing is at the individual delta level, so you really can literally 'dis-integrate' an object into deltas, recombine them, filter them, whatever, then re-integrate into a new object with new properties, etc, all transparently.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. Peter Abrahamsen‏ @peidran 7 Jan 2019
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      Replying to @mykola

      We're (@EdBaskerville and I) starting with Datalog (a la Datomic) and sharing histories of (E,A,V,T, assert/retract) tuples. Don't know how closely that maps to your deltas.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    7. myk is teetering‏ @mykola 7 Jan 2019
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      Replying to @peidran @EdBaskerville

      I want to say that a tuple there corresponds to a delta, if it represents some fully defined state change to your system as of time t. How exactly the delta is expressed is of some limited utility but there's room for many ways to do it, I think.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. Peter Abrahamsen‏ @peidran 7 Jan 2019
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      Replying to @mykola @EdBaskerville

      For the time being, our model of time more closely resembles Hickey's: the operations/transactions of any particular actor are totally ordered. CRDTs ops are partially ordered per application semantics, typically by referring to prior entities. IIUC.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. myk is teetering‏ @mykola 7 Jan 2019
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      Replying to @peidran @EdBaskerville

      This is definitely a tricky part to get right. I've had some success having deltas totally ordered within a transaction but having transactions themselves partially ordered within the larger distributed universe, yeah.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    10. myk is teetering‏ @mykola 7 Jan 2019
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      Replying to @mykola @peidran @EdBaskerville

      I've been toying with the idea of completely discarding wall time as anything other than a data field, and using relative vector clocks where a delta is itself an advancement of 'time'. Hard to do that right in a distsys, though, for sure!

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Peter Abrahamsen‏ @peidran 7 Jan 2019
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      Replying to @mykola @EdBaskerville

      We're keeping transaction timestamps to order transactions locally. They're handy for debugging and might be useful to applications. We haven't talked a lot about what causal relationships will look like as we move that direction, but they'll be application defined.

      5:11 PM - 7 Jan 2019 from Seattle, WA
      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. myk is teetering‏ @mykola 7 Jan 2019
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          Replying to @peidran @EdBaskerville

          oh jeez I have thoughts here too. Causal relationships are sort of where this kind of system can shine if you let the system eat your computation. Any node can be a function, with execution logic that makes more nodes - this is how transactions worked, for me.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. myk is teetering‏ @mykola 7 Jan 2019
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          Replying to @mykola @peidran @EdBaskerville

          this makes a ton of sense if you think of 'objects' as functions which take deltas as their inputs and which can potentially return new deltas as their outputs when they 'mutate'. which you can do because objects aren't real, they can be whatever you want, etc! :)

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. End of conversation

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