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patrissimo's profile
Patri Friedman
Patri Friedman
Patri Friedman
@patrissimo

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Patri Friedman

@patrissimo

On virtue, venture, family, freedom, crypto and (of course) building startup countries on the ocean.

San Jose, CA
patrifriedman.com
Joined October 2008

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    Patri Friedman‏ @patrissimo 22 Dec 2017

    1/ Watching #btc volatility & thinking about current use cases, I finally appreciate why @VitalikButerin says it's important to make a StableCoin. Ppl should be able to store value w/o taking on all this currency risk.

    5:49 PM - 22 Dec 2017 from San Jose, CA
    • 131 Retweets
    • 494 Likes
    • tek。🥀 ⚡0ʇdʎɹƆ‾lƎ Rory Okay Brenner lhl BTCgreenthummbb Yuriy Dybskiy Mona Tomoya Ishizaki
    66 replies 131 retweets 494 likes
      1. New conversation
      2. Patri Friedman‏ @patrissimo 22 Dec 2017

        2/ Obviously some users can hedge via futures, but if you're stashing money b/c you live in a current/potential kleptocracy (the Holocaust scenario) the CBOE is not an option.

        4 replies 25 retweets 75 likes
        Show this thread
      3. Patri Friedman‏ @patrissimo 22 Dec 2017

        3/ As speculators we expect everyone to just join the hodl club, but that exemplifies the immaturity of the tech/us. Most users don't want to be speculators, so if using and speculating are commingled, that's bad for actual use & ultimately for our investment.

        5 replies 8 retweets 60 likes
        Show this thread
      4. Patri Friedman‏ @patrissimo 22 Dec 2017

        4/ A club that won't let anyone in who doesn't want to gamble is going to end up being a club of gamblers, not the world new financial system. A good StableCoin is one possible answer.

        8 replies 37 retweets 182 likes
        Show this thread
      5. Patri Friedman‏ @patrissimo 22 Dec 2017

        5/ Making one, however, without centralization or counterparty risk, is...non-trivial. But deeply fascinating if you're into monetarism & cryptoeconomics! Looking forward to continued community speculation on the topic.

        32 replies 27 retweets 159 likes
        Show this thread
      6. Patri Friedman‏ @patrissimo 22 Dec 2017

        6/ p.s. since many seem unversed in the basics of how & why to make a "StableCoin", some reading: https://blog.ethereum.org/2014/11/11/search-stable-cryptocurrency/ … https://medium.com/topl-blog/dangerous-volatility-and-why-we-need-a-stable-cryptocurrency-6d66dcd605f8 … https://bitshares.org/technology/price-stable-cryptocurrencies/ …https://thecontrol.co/stablecoins-a-holy-grail-in-digital-currency-b64f3371e111 …

        9 replies 11 retweets 68 likes
        Show this thread
      7. End of conversation
      1. New conversation
      2. Vote November 6th‏ @devilscompiler 22 Dec 2017
        Replying to @patrissimo @VitalikButerin

        Cryptocurrencies are emerging technologies. They are by no means ready to offer stability at this stage. Maybe in the future some might be able to stabilize small fluctuations in buy/sell pressure but nothing like what we have today.

        2 replies 1 retweet 11 likes
      3. Patri Friedman‏ @patrissimo 22 Dec 2017
        Replying to @devilscompiler @VitalikButerin

        Right, I'm not suggesting that all tokens (established or new) become stable; just that (as Vitalik has suggested) someone implement a StableCoin: a token specifically designed for stable value. Which is hard - that's why it's interesting.

        6 replies 0 retweets 5 likes
      4. George J Peacock‏ @Peacockg 22 Dec 2017
        Replying to @patrissimo @devilscompiler @VitalikButerin

        The "brave" are willing to fund the development and use of crypto precisely because of the potential gains. The lame (or more cautious) don't understand or buy into crypto and (at least now) wouldn't buy a stable coin. The brave don't care about or want stability.

        3 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
      5. Patri Friedman‏ @patrissimo 22 Dec 2017
        Replying to @Peacockg @devilscompiler @VitalikButerin

        The "brave" claim they are funding something that will transform the global economic system. A system which mainly consists of the "lame". Therefore, the "brave' are liars unless they can create something the "lame" want to use.

        2 replies 0 retweets 13 likes
      6. George J Peacock‏ @Peacockg 22 Dec 2017
        Replying to @patrissimo @devilscompiler @VitalikButerin

        It will come. It's inevitable. It's like stock and bond markets. But crypto is not ready for stable because those who would buy stable aren't ready for crypto.

        2 replies 0 retweets 9 likes
      7. Patri Friedman‏ @patrissimo 22 Dec 2017
        Replying to @Peacockg @devilscompiler @VitalikButerin

        Sure, that's a fair point. But it is important that crypto transitions to real use cases, and many such cases benefit from stability. I don't think it's too soon for research & prototyping (and some is being done).

        1 reply 0 retweets 6 likes
      8. George J Peacock‏ @Peacockg 23 Dec 2017
        Replying to @patrissimo @devilscompiler @VitalikButerin

        Totally agree!

        0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
      9. End of conversation
      1. New conversation
      2. Bobby Shaftoe‏ @robertshaftoe 22 Dec 2017
        Replying to @patrissimo @VitalikButerin

        Check out @Goldmint_io. They're building technology to store and transfer gold on blockchain. Their $GOLD token will be backed 100% by gold.

        1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      3. Patri Friedman‏ @patrissimo 22 Dec 2017
        Replying to @robertshaftoe @VitalikButerin @goldmint_io

        Yes, it's easy to create a pegged currency with 100% reserve...but that requires trusting the issuer. The question is how to create a decentralized stable currency without that counterparty risk.

        5 replies 1 retweet 9 likes
      4. Bobby Shaftoe‏ @robertshaftoe 22 Dec 2017
        Replying to @patrissimo @VitalikButerin @goldmint_io

        2.) They're plan is to have these Custody Bots all over the world. Once the gold is withdrawn from the machine, an equal amount of tokens is removed from the blockchain.

        1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      5. Patri Friedman‏ @patrissimo 22 Dec 2017
        Replying to @robertshaftoe @VitalikButerin @goldmint_io

        That's cool, but it's not a trustless digital asset. How do you keep the bots from being stolen? Put them in banks? But then how is it different from the bank just issuing gold-backed tokens? Also, I feel like the assaying system would be vulnerable to fraud.

        3 replies 0 retweets 5 likes
      6. Bobby Shaftoe‏ @robertshaftoe 23 Dec 2017
        Replying to @patrissimo @VitalikButerin @goldmint_io

        2.) The assaying system is internal to the vault-like machine, so I'm not sure how it would be vulnerable.

        1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      7. Patri Friedman‏ @patrissimo 23 Dec 2017
        Replying to @robertshaftoe @VitalikButerin @goldmint_io

        The assaying system measures physical properties, using tools like a mass spectrometer, to determine the amount of gold. It seems quite likely that there will be a way to spoof it (and immediately withdraw real gold elsewhere).

        1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      8. Bobby Shaftoe‏ @robertshaftoe 23 Dec 2017
        Replying to @patrissimo @VitalikButerin @goldmint_io

        It also will using a hydrostatic weighing system. I know that gold-plated tungsten can be used to fool rudimentary hydrostatic weighing, but I'm not aware of any metal that could pass HS and MS checks. I'll have to look more into it.

        0 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
      9. End of conversation
      1. New conversation
      2. Pralay‏ @pralayhazra 22 Dec 2017
        Replying to @patrissimo @VitalikButerin

        Thank you. That answers my age old question how a coin which is supposed to be every day payment option can also be a HODL? I asked the same question to @SatoshiLite few days back, didn't get an answer.

        3 replies 1 retweet 1 like
      3. Patri Friedman‏ @patrissimo 22 Dec 2017
        Replying to @pralayhazra @VitalikButerin @SatoshiLite

        Right, value fluctuations don't matter for payment, you just convert into it at time of purchase at market rate. But for store of value, most customers want stability, this is money they're saving, not betting at roulette.

        1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
      4. Tweet unavailable
      5. Patri Friedman‏ @patrissimo 22 Dec 2017
        Replying to @ClubVirgins @pralayhazra and

        Well, the payee can insta-convert out too, presumably.

        1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      6. Tweet unavailable
      7. Patri Friedman‏ @patrissimo 22 Dec 2017
        Replying to @ClubVirgins @pralayhazra and

        That's true, you'd need pretty fast transactions. And at that point, why even have a transfer token with floating value? I'm getting kinda skeptical of the utility of floating-valued transfer tokens....

        0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
      8. End of conversation

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