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o_guest's profile
Olivia Guest | Ολίβια Γκεστ
Olivia Guest | Ολίβια Γκεστ
Olivia Guest | Ολίβια Γκεστ
@o_guest

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Olivia Guest | Ολίβια Γκεστ

@o_guest

• goth gremlin • computational cognitive/neuroscience modeling • geek & techish Cypriot • plant aficionada • came up with #bropenscience • http://neuroplausible.com  •

Τότεναμ, Λονδίνο & Cyprus
olivia.science
Joined October 2015

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    1. Grace Lindsay‏ @neurograce 13 Aug 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @IrisVanRooij @chazfirestone and

      This is then a place of honest disagreement for us. Because while I believe the outside world obviously impacts behavior, I see no way for it to do so other than through the nervous system.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    2. Iris van Rooij‏ @IrisVanRooij 13 Aug 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @neurograce @chazfirestone and

      Possibly disagreement, but possibly not, because I do not necessarily disagree with your last claim but it seems to sidestep my point. So perhaps rather misunderstanding?

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. Grace Lindsay‏ @neurograce 13 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @IrisVanRooij @chazfirestone and

      Maybe? I believe that we should (at some point) be able to predict behavior at time t+1 based on neural activity at time t (with neural activity obviously being a result of past & present input from the outside world). Thus behavior can be fully explained by neural activity alone

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    4. Iris van Rooij‏ @IrisVanRooij 13 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @neurograce @chazfirestone and

      Ah! But prediction and explanation are not the same thing, and neither implies the other. I find this paper explains the distinction is an accessible way, using the tides as an example: https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/f5b1/b05e8313aee94ccd98e80eab3ec56dbd2c97.pdf …pic.twitter.com/Lflyct6xkD

      1 reply 0 retweets 5 likes
    5. Iris van Rooij‏ @IrisVanRooij 13 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @IrisVanRooij @neurograce and

      Predicting the tides can be and still is done using tide tables. The explanation did not improve our ability to predict. See excerpt if interested. (cc @o_guest)pic.twitter.com/J7pzGnBrQV

      2 replies 3 retweets 5 likes
    6. Grace Lindsay‏ @neurograce 13 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @IrisVanRooij @chazfirestone and

      Sorry, I meant prediction via running a mechanistic model that maps to physical components of the system, not just descriptive statistical relationships. The idea being that we can build a model (an explanation, essentially) that can tell us behavior solely from neural activity

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    7. Iris van Rooij‏ @IrisVanRooij 13 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @neurograce @chazfirestone and

      Circling back to the Q of what is meant by ‘explanation’. I take it you propose simulation of a brain—in the sense if mimicking neural activity etc—is an explanation? Even if it generates no understanding in anyone’s mind about how that activity relates to cognition or behaviour?

      1 reply 1 retweet 3 likes
    8. Grace Lindsay‏ @neurograce 13 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @IrisVanRooij @chazfirestone and

      I think if we've been able to build a simulation of the brain that captures a lot of neural data & explains behavior, someone at some point has understood some stuff (so I can't really separate those things).

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    9. Grace Lindsay‏ @neurograce 13 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @neurograce @IrisVanRooij and

      And the model provides the opportunity to do things like discover which components of the system are necessary for different outputs, etc. Which counts as understanding to me.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      Olivia Guest | Ολίβια Γκεστ‏ @o_guest 13 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @seymiotics @neurograce and

      Can you imagine a situation in which the model is "perfect" like you describe and yet tells us nothing or very very little? Like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OpenWorm , for example? I don't think OpenWorm is a blip. I think it might be what happens w a lot of reductionist models.

      6:29 AM - 13 Aug 2018
      • 4 Likes
      • KordingLab Jonathan Reardon Paul Miller Seymour
      1 reply 0 retweets 4 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Grace Lindsay‏ @neurograce 13 Aug 2018
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @o_guest @seymiotics and

          OpenWorm is far from a perfect model. there are obviously things going on in C. elegans that we don't know about yet. But we are a lot closer to being able to describe the behavior of worms in terms of neural activity than we are for humans, in part due to efforts like OpenWorm

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        3. Grace Lindsay‏ @neurograce 13 Aug 2018
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          Replying to @neurograce @o_guest and

          Also, can someone just give me a clear example of something that has counted as an explanation to them in psych/neuroscience? Because I honestly think a lot of this is just having a different set of questions we consider interesting & thus different acceptable answers

          0 replies 1 retweet 2 likes
        4. End of conversation

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