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mjtsai's profile
Michael Tsai
Michael Tsai
Michael Tsai
Verified account
@mjtsai

Michael TsaiVerified account

@mjtsai

Mac Software Developer

Joined August 2007
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    1. Friedrich Markgraf ‏@fzwob Jul 18

      @jckarter @steipete @mjtsai main problem with sealed-by-default: makes using stuff for unanticipated use case hard, thus stunts innovation.

      0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    2. Joe Groff ‏@jckarter Jul 18

      @fzwob @steipete @mjtsai Having to support bugs forever for compatibility also stifles innovation. There's tradeoffs.

      0 replies 1 retweet 5 likes
    3. Michael Tsai ‏@mjtsai Jul 18

      @jckarter I don’t understand why you have to support bugs (rather than the promised contract) forever. Why not warn like with deprecation?

      0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    4. Joe Groff ‏@jckarter Jul 18

      @mjtsai If subclassing is part of that contract, you have a lot more compatibility surface area to ensure subclassers don't break.

      0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. Michael Tsai ‏@mjtsai Jul 18

      @jckarter I mean in general—undocumented/unpromised subclassing details and non-subclassing-related bugs.

      0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. Joe Groff ‏@jckarter Jul 18

      @mjtsai That's more important than technically-correct framework bug fixes or refactorings in a lot of cases.

      0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. Patrick Smith ‏@concreteniche Jul 18

      @jckarter @mjtsai Could you almost say that some framework bugs were left unfixed because of easy work arounds being possible?

      0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. Patrick Smith ‏@concreteniche Jul 18

      @jckarter @mjtsai Hopefully this will make it much easier for Apple to fix those framework bugs that are the actual source of pain

      0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    9. Joe Groff ‏@jckarter Jul 18

      @concreteniche @mjtsai I think it'll lead to a more robust third-party framework ecosystem, whatever Apple ends up doing.

      0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    10. Michael Tsai ‏@mjtsai Jul 18

      @jckarter If this is about 3rd party frameworks, the vendor can always put a breaking change in a new version. If necessary to reverse a

      0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
      Michael Tsai Verified account ‏@mjtsai Jul 18

      @jckarter bad decision. Whereas the framework client, without the ability to override, has no recourse.

      • Like 1
      • Daniel Jalkut
      5:57 PM - 18 Jul 2016
      0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        1. Patrick Smith ‏@concreteniche Jul 18

          @mjtsai @jckarter Hopefully though those frameworks are using value types, where they don’t get the ability to subclass/override anyway

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        2. View other replies
        3. Patrick Smith ‏@concreteniche Jul 18

          @mjtsai @jckarter If framework authors used classes because clients are more comfortable and able to monkey patch, I think that’d be sad

          0 replies 1 retweet 1 like
        4. Patrick Smith ‏@concreteniche Jul 18

          @mjtsai @jckarter AFAIK protocols would allow the most of same sorts of custom extending desired, and are explicitly designed to be so

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        5. Michael Tsai ‏@mjtsai Jul 18

          @concreteniche @jckarter Probably not as flexible. And changing classes to protocols doesn’t make the design/thinking issues go away.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        6. View other replies
        7. Joe Groff ‏@jckarter Jul 18

          @mjtsai @concreteniche You can easily wrap a conforming type and patch or completely replace its conformance if you need to.

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        8. View other replies
        9. Michael Tsai ‏@mjtsai Jul 18

          @jckarter @concreteniche Yes, but patching from the outside is limited because you can’t override anything that’s not in the protocol.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        10. View other replies
        11. Joe Groff ‏@jckarter Jul 18

          @mjtsai @concreteniche The client also can't *use* anything that's not in the protocol. The interface goes both ways.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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        13. Daniel Jalkut ‏@danielpunkass Jul 18

          @jckarter @mjtsai @concreteniche … the developer's implementation would de facto always have the last say on behavior.

          0 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
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