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michael_nielsen
michael_nielsen
michael_nielsen
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michael_nielsen

@michael_nielsen

Searching for the numinous. Co-purveyor of https://quantum.country/ 

San Francisco, CA
michaelnielsen.org
Joined July 2008

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    michael_nielsen‏ @michael_nielsen 6 Mar 2018
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    Many people in the Bay Area argue that NIMBYs ignore the basic economics of supply and demand. Build more housing, they argue, and prices will inevitably drop.

    8:18 PM - 6 Mar 2018
    • 11 Likes
    • Leona Hu Hudelson Max Tagher Jamie Mason 🏃🏻✂️ Eugene Wei Matt Howlett Yasaman Bahri Brinda Thomas Yad Konrad
    9 replies 0 retweets 11 likes
      1. New conversation
      2. michael_nielsen‏ @michael_nielsen 6 Mar 2018
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        In the very near term, this seems right. Over the long run, I'm genuinely uncertain whether to believe this.

        4 replies 0 retweets 4 likes
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      3. michael_nielsen‏ @michael_nielsen 6 Mar 2018
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        In Braess's paradox, increasing the capacity of a road to carry traffic may actually lead to more congestion, since more people will want to use it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Braess%27s_paradox …

        3 replies 1 retweet 11 likes
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      4. michael_nielsen‏ @michael_nielsen 6 Mar 2018
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        What bothers me is that generally speaking the biggest cities (a) have the largest supply of housing; and (b) have the highest prices, because being big makes them so attractive. So a large supply is actually anti-correlated with low prices.

        2 replies 2 retweets 9 likes
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      5. michael_nielsen‏ @michael_nielsen 6 Mar 2018
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        So while I believe the supply-and-demand argument over, say, a 1-year timescale, I wonder if it's false over 20 years. Make housing a lot easier to build, SF will become a much bigger city, and prices may go up even more.

        6 replies 2 retweets 8 likes
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      6. michael_nielsen‏ @michael_nielsen 6 Mar 2018
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        A counter-argument would be to say something like: what's needed is to ensure a permanent structural increase in the _fraction_ of the city's housing stock that is available.

        3 replies 0 retweets 7 likes
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      7. michael_nielsen‏ @michael_nielsen 6 Mar 2018
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        That argument seems pretty good to me (though, as with the first argument, I'm also not sure of it). But it's not the argument I often hear from the NIMBYs-are-ignorant-of-economics people.

        2 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
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      8. End of conversation
      1. Alan Laidlaw‏ @alanlaidlaw 6 Mar 2018
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        Replying to @michael_nielsen

        I first read that 1st sentence as “NUMPY” and exclaimed, “how DARE they!”

        0 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
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      1. John Waterson  🌍‏ @jdwaterson 7 Mar 2018
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        Replying to @michael_nielsen

        Hi Michael, the Oxford economist @sjwrenlewis wrote about a UK version of this problem recently. tl;dr Supply of housing is greatly affected by share of housing assets available for rent, which in turn is greatly affected by interest rates. https://mainlymacro.blogspot.co.uk/2018/02/house-prices-and-rents-in-uk.html …

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      1. Jack Lion Heart‏ @jackheartlion 6 Mar 2018
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        Replying to @michael_nielsen

        Housing supply is an important aspect of the problem, but far from the only thing that matters. Re: increased demand, the biggest factor is jobs. And many Bay Area cities love adding jobs but never add housing. PA has a 3:1 ratio.

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      2. joe‏ @twitskeptic 6 Mar 2018
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        Replying to @michael_nielsen

        Good thread. I too have wondered about the paradox of high prices in dense cities that have limited building restrictions. And also wondered about the sensitivity of price to supply changes. Difficult to argue this with urbanists, though, who tend to be quite ideological

        1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      3. joe‏ @twitskeptic 6 Mar 2018
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        Replying to @twitskeptic @michael_nielsen

        Have also looked for any attempts to model this without success

        0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
      4. End of conversation

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