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michael_nielsen's profile
michael_nielsen
michael_nielsen
michael_nielsen
@michael_nielsen

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michael_nielsen

@michael_nielsen

Searching for the numinous. Co-purveyor of https://quantum.country/ 

San Francisco, CA
michaelnielsen.org
Joined July 2008

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    1. Zack Kanter‏Verified account @zackkanter Jun 14
      • Report Tweet

      ‘Loophole’ is such great branding. Loopholes don’t exist - there are only ‘laws.’ Flawed laws are rebranded as loopholes. Similar to pharma’s invention of ‘side effects.’ There‘s no such thing as a side effect - there are only effects. Bad effects are rebranded as side effects.

      8 replies 44 retweets 274 likes
    2. michael_nielsen‏ @michael_nielsen Jun 14
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @zackkanter

      You seem to think that if something is legal it's therefore moral? Do you think slavery was moral before it was made illegal? Or lots of other (obviously immoral) things that used to be legal?

      1 reply 0 retweets 6 likes
    3. Zack Kanter‏Verified account @zackkanter Jun 14
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @michael_nielsen

      That’s an unfair leap, and I’m surprised you made it. Not everything that is immoral is illegal, and not everything that is illegal is immoral. What I’m saying is that when it comes to taxes, I struggle to clearly define “moral” in a way other than “legal.”

      4 replies 0 retweets 15 likes
    4. Zack Kanter‏Verified account @zackkanter Jun 14
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @zackkanter @michael_nielsen

      Zack Kanter Retweeted Zack Kanter

      https://twitter.com/zackkanter/status/1139670890759806978?s=21 …

      Zack Kanter added,

      Zack KanterVerified account @zackkanter
      It finally clicked for me that some people seem to believe that there is a difference between a company’s legal minimum tax obligation and a company’s moral minimum tax obligation. I’d be fascinated to see someone take a stab at writing a framework for calculating the latter. https://twitter.com/JoeBiden/status/1139188173131591685 …
      2 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
    5. michael_nielsen‏ @michael_nielsen Jun 14
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @zackkanter

      I think I probably misinterpreted your original tweet as implying that you thought there is no difference. Glad to hear that's not the case, and sorry for the misinterpretation.

      1 reply 0 retweets 7 likes
    6. michael_nielsen‏ @michael_nielsen Jun 14
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @michael_nielsen @zackkanter

      Granted that there often is a difference between what's moral and what's legal, it seems quite reasonable that many people's morality suggests companies should pay more than the legal minimum.

      2 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
    7. Zack Kanter‏Verified account @zackkanter Jun 14
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @michael_nielsen

      I hear that. What I'm wondering is that if people are going to judge companies by a moral standard for taxes (above and beyond legal minimum), how would they go about designing a framework for determining what's moral and what isn't?

      3 replies 0 retweets 5 likes
      michael_nielsen‏ @michael_nielsen Jun 14
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @zackkanter

      Great question! But I've got to disappear to an early dinner. I guess my intuition is: individual ethics is fantastically difficult and complicated; it seems likely the same for a type of collective ethics applicable to companies. I'd happily read a good book on it...

      4:53 PM - 14 Jun 2019
      • 4 Likes
      • Meghan Kane Oisín Moran Eddie Romanzo Zack Kanter
      3 replies 0 retweets 4 likes
        1. Zack Kanter‏Verified account @zackkanter Jun 14
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @michael_nielsen

          Glad we had a productive conversation - enjoy dinner.

          0 replies 0 retweets 6 likes
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        2. michael_nielsen‏ @michael_nielsen Jun 14
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @michael_nielsen @zackkanter

          (Seems related to things like Time-Well-Spent. And Naderism in the 1960s. Etc. Essentially any regulatory-normative movement for companies.)

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        3. michael_nielsen‏ @michael_nielsen Jun 14
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @michael_nielsen @zackkanter

          (Great set of questions, thank you Zack!)

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        4. End of conversation
        1. mrgunn‏ @mrgunn Jun 15
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @michael_nielsen @zackkanter

          Just when you think one of the greatest thinkers of our time is going to answer one of the biggest questions of our time... damn, he has to go to dinner.

          0 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
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