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mattgurney's profile
Matt Gurney
Matt Gurney
Matt Gurney
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@mattgurney

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Matt GurneyVerified account

@mattgurney

Talking head at Global News Radio 640 Toronto (@AM640). Columnist @GlobalNews. Ex-@NationalPost. Husband. Dad. Tired. Tweets my own. Matt@640toronto.com

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Joined September 2010

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    Matt Gurney‏Verified account @mattgurney Apr 24

    Question for the hivemind: how broadly can we realistically define "ideology" as a motive for terrorism under Canadian law? The more I'm reading about these incel assholes, the more I feel like they meet the threshold. But ... is there a reasonably well-defined threshold at all?

    5:45 PM - 24 Apr 2018
    • 6 Retweets
    • 34 Likes
    • J. Anthony Skuce Agatha Farmer Oatbag Kyle Phillips Nadine LeGros Eveline Gaumond Jim Harvie Cheryl k. Sinéad O'Brien
    17 replies 6 retweets 34 likes
      1. New conversation
      2. Matt Gurney‏Verified account @mattgurney Apr 24

        It seems to me that the political and religious motivations would be (relatively) easy to establish, but ideology just seems trickier. You probably did need something like that included in the law, to cover wildcards like this, but ... how do we define it?

        2 replies 1 retweet 6 likes
        Show this thread
      3. Matt Gurney‏Verified account @mattgurney Apr 24

        To be clear, I understand why it's very unlikely that the Crown will actually pursue terror charges (no real point), so I'm just asking for the sake of my own curiosity.

        3 replies 1 retweet 6 likes
        Show this thread
      4. End of conversation
      1. New conversation
      2. Jen "Skeletor" Gerson‏Verified account @jengerson Apr 25
        Replying to @mattgurney

        With the caveat that we still don't know a lot, this would meet the definition IMO.

        1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      3. Matt Gurney‏Verified account @mattgurney Apr 25
        Replying to @jengerson

        I'm not sure there IS a definition.

        1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      4. Jen "Skeletor" Gerson‏Verified account @jengerson Apr 25
        Replying to @mattgurney

        There is, it's just nuanced. You need to show motivation and that is not easy to do hours after an attack.

        1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      5. Matt Gurney‏Verified account @mattgurney Apr 25
        Replying to @jengerson

        I don't think the problem is defining motivation. It's defining ideology.

        2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
      6. Matt Gurney‏Verified account @mattgurney Apr 25
        Replying to @mattgurney @jengerson

        Do you need a guru of some kind? A manifesto? Underground publishing?

        4 replies 0 retweets 1 like
      7. JRMarlow‏ @JRMarlow Apr 25
        Replying to @mattgurney @jengerson

        If the perpetrator is acting independently and suffers from some sort of mental illness (an important caveat), does it even matter if he did because he was having a bad day or because he thought it would appease the sun god?

        1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      8. Matt Gurney‏Verified account @mattgurney Apr 25
        Replying to @JRMarlow @jengerson

        Well for the dead and injured I'm not sure motive matters at all. It's just us who see value in the conversation.

        2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
      9. JRMarlow‏ @JRMarlow Apr 25
        Replying to @mattgurney @jengerson

        I'm asking why you think it matters. Again, assuming he acted independently and mental illness played a role, what's the importance of his guiding ideology or motivation?

        1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      10. 3 more replies
      1. New conversation
      2. Andray‏Verified account @andraydomise Apr 25
        Replying to @mattgurney

        Spend some time in the incel forums (as well as the general "manosphere") and the ideology shapes up pretty quickly. They hate themselves, and they hate people (especially women) who have fulfilling sex lives. SPLC categorizes MRAs as hate groups, and incels are the MRA fringe.

        2 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
      3. Matt Gurney‏Verified account @mattgurney Apr 25
        Replying to @andraydomise

        No doubt, but I think for our purposes here, it's more what the Crown would deem an ideology vs. a bunch of losers agreeing with each other. I'm not sure we've really tested that.

        1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      4. Andray‏Verified account @andraydomise Apr 25
        Replying to @mattgurney

        Word. But one could argue that "a bunch of losers agreeing with each other" sums up the core of any recognized terror group. It's doofuses who find each other online that move to Syria and fight for Daesh, or stab train passengers while shouting white power slogans

        2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
      5. Matt Gurney‏Verified account @mattgurney Apr 25
        Replying to @andraydomise

        I confess I'm playing catch up on the incel stuff. But it's grim if fascinating.

        1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      6. Andray‏Verified account @andraydomise Apr 25
        Replying to @mattgurney

        I've been lurking their forums for years, and will be doing a bit of a backgrounder on it. I can say without hyperbole that it's the most depressing and alarming corner of the internet there is. This is the pool from which extremist groups trawl for new recruits.

        1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
      7. Matt Gurney‏Verified account @mattgurney Apr 25
        Replying to @andraydomise

        I will genuinely look forward to your piece.

        0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
      8. End of conversation
      1. New conversation
      2. Tom Nichols‏Verified account @RadioFreeTom Apr 24
        Replying to @mattgurney

        I don't think "I found some other losers on the internet and agree with them" passes my test (personally).

        2 replies 0 retweets 8 likes
      3. Matt Gurney‏Verified account @mattgurney Apr 24
        Replying to @RadioFreeTom

        Well if that was it we'd all have to turn ourselves in.

        1 reply 0 retweets 4 likes
      4. Matt Gurney‏Verified account @mattgurney Apr 24
        Replying to @mattgurney @RadioFreeTom

        (You read that in a Chekov accent, right?)

        1 reply 0 retweets 4 likes
      5. 1 more reply

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