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marcan42's profile
Hector Martin
Hector Martin
Hector Martin
@marcan42

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Hector Martin

@marcan42

If it ain't broke, I'll fix it! I'm porting Linux to Apple Silicon Macs at @AsahiLinux. http://patreon.com/marcan  | http://github.com/sponsors/marcan 

Tokyo, Japan
marcan.st
Joined May 2009

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    1. Hector Martin‏ @marcan42 10 Jun 2020
      • Report Tweet
      • Report NetzDG Violation

      Ha, Intel were *so proud* of their high throughput RDRAND, and now it turns out they leak the values all over the other cores and the microcode patch to fix it... has a 97% performance hit. As in you get ~1/30th of the performance you used to. Whoops! https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=RdRand-3-Percent …

      9 replies 246 retweets 591 likes
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    2. Yehuda Lindell‏ @LindellYehuda 10 Jun 2020
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      Replying to @marcan42

      Just asking - isn't the natural thing to anyway do is to seed a PRG (e.g., in OpenSSL) using RDRAND. In that case, you don't need to call RDRAND very much. Am I missing something?

      1 reply 0 retweets 6 likes
    3. Fan Zhang‏ @0xFanZhang 10 Jun 2020
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      Replying to @LindellYehuda @marcan42

      Happen to stumble on this: "If you wish to seed another pseudorandom number generator (PRNG), use RDSEED"---https://software.intel.com/content/www/us/en/develop/blogs/the-difference-between-rdrand-and-rdseed.html …

      1 reply 0 retweets 6 likes
    4. Yehuda Lindell‏ @LindellYehuda 10 Jun 2020
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      Replying to @0xFanZhang @marcan42

      I’m familiar with this. However, as a cryptographer, seeding a PRG with the output of a good PRG is also good enough. In any case, you can seed with RDSEED. Maybe the idea for someone who doesn’t want to run their own PRG????

      2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
    5. Hector Martin‏ @marcan42 10 Jun 2020
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      Replying to @LindellYehuda @0xFanZhang

      Intel's idea was that yes, you can just pull randomness straight out of RDRAND instead of seeding something else. Not a lot of people used it like that, but some did.

      2 replies 0 retweets 5 likes
    6. Tony “Abolish (Pol)ICE” Arcieri  🦀‏ @bascule 10 Jun 2020
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      Replying to @marcan42 @LindellYehuda @0xFanZhang

      Seems like it’s time to put RDRAND out to pasture and just use RDSEED

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    7. Hector Martin‏ @marcan42 10 Jun 2020
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      Replying to @bascule @LindellYehuda @0xFanZhang

      What makes you think RDSEED doesn't go through the exact same bus and have all the same problems?

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    8. Yehuda Lindell‏ @LindellYehuda 10 Jun 2020
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      Replying to @marcan42 @bascule @0xFanZhang

      I'm not saying it doesn't. What I'm saying is that you don't need to use it frequently and so if it slows everything down to a halt when you sample it once a day, it's not the end of the world.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Hector Martin‏ @marcan42 10 Jun 2020
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      Replying to @LindellYehuda @bascule @0xFanZhang

      You're still screwed. If you're running untrusted code on another core: 1) without the mitigation, they can steal your secrets 2) with the mitigation, they can DoS your memory bus performance. The only solution is to not mitigate and not use RDRAND/SEED at all.

      10:54 PM - 10 Jun 2020
      • 6 Likes
      • Dan P Imaskar Adrian Rueegsegger gwillen CodeAsm | Panda 🐼 Yehuda Lindell
      0 replies 0 retweets 6 likes

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