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marcan42's profile
Hector Martin
Hector Martin
Hector Martin
@marcan42

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Hector Martin

@marcan42

If it ain't broke, I'll fix it! I'm porting Linux to Apple Silicon Macs at @AsahiLinux. http://patreon.com/marcan  | http://github.com/sponsors/marcan 

Tokyo, Japan
marcan.st
Joined May 2009

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    1. Hector Martin‏ @marcan42 11 May 2020
      • Report Tweet
      • Report NetzDG Violation
      Replying to @RichFelker @MissingClara

      The key is in *your* already trusted device. It's not some kind of global master key. You need to break into an already trusted device. The right way to stop DMA attacks is with an IOMMU, which is complementary to all this. Proper IOMMU usage blocks all this crap anyway.

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    2. Rich Felker‏ @RichFelker 11 May 2020
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      Replying to @marcan42 @MissingClara

      IOMMU, or just not having bus mastering. But yeah. Problem is none of their IOMMUs work. They don't fail closed.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    3. Dr. Stephen Checkoway‏ @stevecheckoway 11 May 2020
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      Replying to @RichFelker @marcan42 @MissingClara

      Why is that? I haven't looked at how one actually programs an IOMMU. Is it a fundamental limitation or some sort of "we can't break existing devices relying on being able to read/write anywhere"?

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    4. Rich Felker‏ @RichFelker 11 May 2020
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      Replying to @stevecheckoway @marcan42 @MissingClara

      AIUI it's disabled by default until the OS enables it, bypassable in various ways, and not supported by lots of drivers so OS ends up turning it partially or fully off...

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    5. Rich Felker‏ @RichFelker 11 May 2020
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      Replying to @RichFelker @stevecheckoway and

      Also even if a driver uses it, it can use it wrong by sharing memory containing pointers into another memory space (eg kernel memory) that device can then clobber.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    6. Rich Felker‏ @RichFelker 11 May 2020
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      Replying to @RichFelker @stevecheckoway and

      Right OS model is not to allow drivers to setup their own IOMMU mappings or DMA buffers, force everything through permanent DMA bounce buffers owned by kernel in fixed ranges.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. Hector Martin‏ @marcan42 11 May 2020
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      Replying to @RichFelker @stevecheckoway @MissingClara

      That is not a reasonable approach. It has too much performance cost. It wouldn't work in any sensible way for e.g. graphics or high performance networking.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    8. Rich Felker‏ @RichFelker 12 May 2020
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      Replying to @marcan42 @stevecheckoway @MissingClara

      Relevant to 1% of systems and the other 99% have to suffer insecure architecture for it.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. Hector Martin‏ @marcan42 12 May 2020
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      Replying to @RichFelker @stevecheckoway @MissingClara

      You do realize that cloud is a huge market and they care about network performance, and that gamers are a rather important market and they care about graphics performance, right? Sorry, no, your approach is not viable in the general case.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    10. Rich Felker‏ @RichFelker 12 May 2020
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      Replying to @marcan42 @stevecheckoway @MissingClara

      Gamers don't run Linux. Hypervisors don't need to use the same architecture end user devices do.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      Hector Martin‏ @marcan42 12 May 2020
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      Replying to @RichFelker @stevecheckoway @MissingClara

      Ah, so your argument is that Linux should be secure on the desktop but Windows shouldn't? And that Linux should have crippled graphics performance because nobody cares? Sorry, no. I'm not a PC gamer but I enjoy my compositing, Blender, and other GPU-reliant tasks performing well

      12:13 AM - 12 May 2020
      • 2 Likes
      • remmy the vessel of morganna
      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
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        2. Rich Felker‏ @RichFelker 12 May 2020
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          Replying to @marcan42 @stevecheckoway @MissingClara

          Roughly. I just want the gpu reliant tasks gone from the essential software stacks. For so many reasons.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Hector Martin‏ @marcan42 12 May 2020
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          Replying to @RichFelker @stevecheckoway @MissingClara

          Giving people a choice between security and performance, people will choose performance. Doing it the lazy way is dumb and does not help improve the state of things. We need solutions that actually perform so they can be universally deployed.

          1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
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