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marcan42's profile
Hector Martin
Hector Martin
Hector Martin
@marcan42

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Hector Martin

@marcan42

If it ain't broke, I'll fix it! I'm porting Linux to Apple Silicon Macs at @AsahiLinux. http://patreon.com/marcan  | http://github.com/sponsors/marcan 

Tokyo, Japan
marcan.st
Joined May 2009

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    1. Hector Martin‏ @marcan42 29 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @marcan42 @11rcombs

      This actually got me thinking of the DSP implications. I know how sampling and aliasing work in the frequency axis, but clearly phase matters too. Shifting the sampling phase shifts the phase at which the upper spectrum half folds over? I need to think about this.

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    2. Hector Martin‏ @marcan42 29 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @marcan42 @11rcombs

      Like, obviously when the downsampling aligns with the nonzero samples you get constructive aliasing interference, and when it aligns with the zeros you get destructive interference, but why?

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    3. Hector Martin‏ @marcan42 29 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @marcan42 @11rcombs

      Paging @xiphmont. Any pointers as to how to explain this time-domain phenomenon in the frequency domain? How does the phase of aliased downsampling affect the phase of the spectral components that get folded together?

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    4. Monty‏ @xiphmont 29 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @marcan42 @11rcombs

      Honestly, never thought about aliasing in detail except how best to avoid it. In the early says of ADC/DAC, the imaging filters purposely allowed some aliasing to get perflectly 'flat' response to nyquist, but that fell out of favor. Possibly due to related question :-)

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    5. Monty‏ @xiphmont 29 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @xiphmont @marcan42 @11rcombs

      There's nothing *that* tricky about it I suppose--- it would be a fun excercise when I'm not busy. Can probably just graph it out and that would be enough.

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    6. Hector Martin‏ @marcan42 29 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @xiphmont @11rcombs

      I think the answer will be obvious by simply plotting the phase response of a pure time delay. Going to try that now.

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    7. Monty‏ @xiphmont 29 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @marcan42 @11rcombs

      "straight line", and I suppose it just folds at Nyquist like the magnitude.

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    8. Hector Martin‏ @marcan42 29 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @xiphmont @11rcombs

      Yeah, I can't quite picture it in my head but I think aliasing affects phase (negates it or something like that), so then depending on input phase it can make the resulting signal either completely in-phase or out of phase with the folded alias. Going to try some jupyter-fu.

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    9. Hector Martin‏ @marcan42 29 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @marcan42 @xiphmont @11rcombs

      Yeah, so the phase of an alias folds around Nyquist *and* gets negated (in the φ=-φ sense, not the 180° shift sense). That's the trick. Notice how 90...180 gets folded into -180...-90. Then when you add both halves together, they cancel out. Remove the 1s delay, and they don't.pic.twitter.com/JpGkBme5Xo

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    10. Hector Martin‏ @marcan42 29 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @marcan42 @xiphmont @11rcombs

      So maybe it's more correct to say that aliasing folds magnitude around Nyquist but *rotates* phase around the Nyquist,0° point.

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      Hector Martin‏ @marcan42 29 Aug 2018
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      Replying to @marcan42 @xiphmont @11rcombs

      And if I haven't completely forgotten my complex math, negating the phase is equivalent to negating the imaginary component of the complex result at a given frequency. This is interesting, it means there's a discontinuity at Nyquist; aliasing isn't "smooth" I guess.

      2:26 AM - 29 Aug 2018
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