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fozmeadows's profile
Foz Meadows
Foz Meadows
Foz Meadows
@fozmeadows

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Foz Meadows

@fozmeadows

Author, fanwriter, trash bandit, queer geek feminist, dork. Jack of all pronouns, mxtress of none. Yells about hockey. Aussie in the US.

Irvine, CA
fozmeadows.wordpress.com
Joined February 2009

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    1. Foz Meadows‏ @fozmeadows 13 Jul 2018

      But even then, there's a sense that *being* cultured is an objective measure, set against static yardsticks. This type of AI/robot doesn't make its own culture; it just reiterates what already exists, like a nerd reciting trivia about a TV show.

      1 reply 6 retweets 84 likes
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    2. Foz Meadows‏ @fozmeadows 13 Jul 2018

      This being so, it strikes me as significant that the authors I've seen who *do* imbue their robots/AIs with culture and personality tend to have more diverse backgrounds; these are stories where people have culture, so if robots are people, then THEY have culture, too.

      1 reply 12 retweets 85 likes
      Show this thread
    3. Foz Meadows‏ @fozmeadows 13 Jul 2018

      Which means we've got this fascinating dichotomy between stories where the defining quality of humanity is our intelligence, with uniformity seen as an evolved state, versus stories where stories were we're defined by our cultures, with diversity essential to evolution.

      1 reply 13 retweets 104 likes
      Show this thread
    4. Foz Meadows‏ @fozmeadows 13 Jul 2018

      The creepier dichotomy nestled within this one is that, in the humanity-as-intelligence model, this only mostly applies to male-coded robots. In stories where fembots (often sexbots) are viewed as aware, their humanity is more often proved by feeling - notably love or suffering.

      3 replies 14 retweets 103 likes
      Show this thread
    5. Foz Meadows‏ @fozmeadows 13 Jul 2018

      Just as creepily, there's also a notion of Single Robot Exceptionalism in these western stories. It's not just ALL robots who can think, generally speaking: it's a special chosen few who've transcended and become better than their fellows. Like a weird eugenics metaphor.

      1 reply 7 retweets 80 likes
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    6. Foz Meadows‏ @fozmeadows 13 Jul 2018

      And the more I think about it, the more I think there's a powerful straight white male fantasy embedded in those robot stories. Viz: you are part of a fundamentally superior group, but you are a second-class citizen because the people in charge don't see your true intelligence.

      1 reply 13 retweets 80 likes
      Show this thread
    7. Foz Meadows‏ @fozmeadows 13 Jul 2018

      Once you've exhibited your intelligence - which marks you out as smarter even than your superior-oppressed fellows - you teach the people in charge how dumb they are, and how inferior, and set about reodering society with a total power reversal, or with you as an Exceptional One.

      2 replies 7 retweets 59 likes
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    8. Foz Meadows‏ @fozmeadows 13 Jul 2018

      And like. It's not that I'm opposed to people fantasising about whatever through the medium of fiction; that's kind of what fiction is *for*. But I think it's important be aware of exactly what we're fantasising *about*, and why, and how those tropes got started.

      1 reply 6 retweets 68 likes
      Show this thread
    9. Foz Meadows‏ @fozmeadows 13 Jul 2018

      And in terms of how robots/AIs are frequently written in western SF canon, I think it's significant that their personhood - their Pure Intelligence - is so often predicated on being *better than* things like tradition, subcultural nuances, faith, whimsy, emotion.

      1 reply 10 retweets 76 likes
      Show this thread
    10. Foz Meadows‏ @fozmeadows 13 Jul 2018

      - all the things, in other words, that characterise cultural worldbuilding, or cultures in general. The church of rational order as preached by SF doesn't recognise itself as a cultural choice, and so treats itself as a natural state to which emerging intelligence defaults.

      1 reply 8 retweets 72 likes
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      Foz Meadows‏ @fozmeadows 13 Jul 2018

      We don't have stories where early robots/AIs go through a "savage" phase whereby they invent their own ghosts or superstitions or myths or religions, or where they develop subroutines that are done in a certain way for festive/ritual purposes. No: just "clean" intelligence.

      8:24 PM - 13 Jul 2018
      • 11 Retweets
      • 98 Likes
      • Ken Marable mишка Some Old Fart Maia aproustian spqr blues Kate Russell, MS, RDN Dorian Graves Principia
      7 replies 11 retweets 98 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Foz Meadows‏ @fozmeadows 13 Jul 2018

          There's likewise an absence of robot/AI communities; we see them as largely isolated individuals, and god, I'd love a story that digs into how platonic or communal relationships emerge in lieu of family structures for robots, but those bonds get stripped away, too.

          9 replies 5 retweets 88 likes
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        3. Foz Meadows‏ @fozmeadows 13 Jul 2018

          Anyway - this musing brought to you courtesy of the wonderful novella All Systems Red by @marthawells1, which I'd shied away from for ages because nebulous dislike of robot sentience stories but which I actually loved, and which has now made me Think Thoughts about things. FIN

          12 replies 9 retweets 134 likes
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        4. End of conversation
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        2. Dr Naomi Jacobs‏ @The_Ladylark 14 Jul 2018
          Replying to @KiraOfTheSea @fozmeadows

          I second this, your thread made me think of some of what they've been doing in s3. They don't escape all the pitfalls, but are more aware of these tropes than most.

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
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        1. Eforest‏ @EForestDan 13 Jul 2018
          Replying to @fozmeadows

          This thread has motivated me even more that I need to pick up one of my old WIPs soon. Its meant to deal with some of these themes as AI form on a mining-colony hellscape devoid of any human intervention.

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
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        1. aproustian‏ @aproustian 14 Jul 2018
          Replying to @fozmeadows

          In a different medium, Destiny has the Vex, robots who regularly perform religious rituals for their own reasons A lot of people were like, “why???” (There is lore that explains it, eventually) And now this thread has me thinking about why it seemed so strange with the Vex...

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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        2. ck‏ @mobileck 14 Jul 2018
          Replying to @fozmeadows

          great thread, but asimov did write a story about robots going through a savage phase where they invent their own religion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reason_(short_story) …

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. ck‏ @mobileck 14 Jul 2018
          Replying to @mobileck @fozmeadows

          it still filled with everything you said though

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. End of conversation

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