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emptywheel's profile
emptywheel
emptywheel
emptywheel
@emptywheel

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emptywheel

@emptywheel

Abundant tweets about civil liberties & national security. "Has a longer memory than an elephant & keeps more records than Jim Comey.” Legendary potty mouth.

Grand Rapids, MI
emptywheel.net
Joined August 2008

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    1. Brian Beutler‏Verified account @brianbeutler 8 Dec 2017
      Replying to @bmaz

      I’m on team “this is pedantry.” Collusion is a fine term for a pattern of political misconduct that may have entailed crimes. Better off trying to give it concrete meaning, since it is in such wide use, than scolding everyone for using it.

      2 replies 0 retweets 32 likes
    2. Brian Beutler‏Verified account @brianbeutler 8 Dec 2017
      Replying to @brianbeutler @bmaz

      Mueller will figure out what, if any laws were broken. “Collusion” is a valuable concept, because it is highly scandalous, even if they pulled it off without committing any crimes.

      2 replies 1 retweet 37 likes
    3. emptywheel‏ @emptywheel 8 Dec 2017
      Replying to @brianbeutler @bmaz

      And also a ridiculously bad one bc Trump can and has spent his time disproving collusion as a way to distract from quid pro quo.

      1 reply 1 retweet 18 likes
    4. bmaz‏ @bmaz 8 Dec 2017
      Replying to @emptywheel @brianbeutler

      The actual legal truth is actually easier to convey, and, again, broader, than the false meme the Trumpies have posited. There is seriously no reason to further false framing.

      4 replies 1 retweet 9 likes
    5. Brian Beutler‏Verified account @brianbeutler 8 Dec 2017
      Replying to @bmaz @emptywheel

      The Trumpies didn’t foist the word collusion on anyone, but collusion will still do a good job describing the relationship even if Mueller brings zero conspiracy charges.

      3 replies 0 retweets 15 likes
    6. Glenn Greenwald‏Verified account @ggreenwald 8 Dec 2017
      Replying to @brianbeutler @bmaz @emptywheel

      What job do you expect "collusion" to perform if Mueller brings no charges alleging it?

      1 reply 0 retweets 12 likes
    7. Brian Beutler‏Verified account @brianbeutler 8 Dec 2017
      Replying to @ggreenwald @bmaz @emptywheel

      Well, it won’t do anything if people think it’s fine to enlist the help of foreign spies in elections. But if you think that’s scandalous, as I do, then “collusion” is a fine way to describe the relationship, and it remains apt even if no laws were broken.

      5 replies 0 retweets 45 likes
    8. emptywheel‏ @emptywheel 8 Dec 2017
      Replying to @brianbeutler @ggreenwald @bmaz

      Um. You mean like Steele paying RU spies for dirt on Trump? You might want to be very careful how you wave that accusation around.

      5 replies 0 retweets 17 likes
    9. Glenn Greenwald‏Verified account @ggreenwald 8 Dec 2017
      Replying to @emptywheel @brianbeutler @bmaz

      Yes, exactly. Every presidential campaign would take dirt about their opponent no matter where it came from, including from big bad dirty foreigners. I don't get why people keep defining it so broadly. (Steele + stuff like this: https://www.politico.com/story/2017/01/ukraine-sabotage-trump-backfire-233446 …)

      7 replies 3 retweets 14 likes
    10. Andrew Van Ligten‏ @AVanLigten 8 Dec 2017
      Replying to @ggreenwald @emptywheel and

      I think there is something to distinguish between gathering information from possibly foreign sources and actively promoting information you know to be gained illegally. Not illegal but normatively worrisome

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      emptywheel‏ @emptywheel 8 Dec 2017
      Replying to @AVanLigten @ggreenwald and

      I agree (tho Brian didn't make that distinction). It has yet to be proven that Trump's folks were certain the emails were illegally obtained, esp by RU.

      9:29 AM - 8 Dec 2017
      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        1. New conversation
        1. Andrew Van Ligten‏ @AVanLigten 8 Dec 2017
          Replying to @emptywheel @ggreenwald and

          Fair, but again, the issue is not whether they knew with certainty that they were from RU, but whether they believed they were getting this support and were in contact with representative of the Russian government

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        2. emptywheel‏ @emptywheel 8 Dec 2017
          Replying to @AVanLigten @ggreenwald and

          Again, proof for that? We've got June 9 meeting, which is a false narrative right now, but which says they DID NOT take anything. Other known receipts from WikiLeaks, not RU. When truth of June 9 meeting comes out things will change, but press is still covering cover story

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        3. Andrew Van Ligten‏ @AVanLigten 8 Dec 2017
          Replying to @emptywheel @ggreenwald and

          The papadopolous statement of offense is onepic.twitter.com/E7myRr72qx

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
          4. End of conversation

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