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emptywheel's profile
emptywheel
emptywheel
emptywheel
@emptywheel

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emptywheel

@emptywheel

Abundant tweets about civil liberties & national security. "Has a longer memory than an elephant & keeps more records than Jim Comey.” Legendary potty mouth.

Grand Rapids, MI
emptywheel.net
Joined August 2008

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    1. Cyrus Farivar‏Verified account @cfarivar 28 Jan 2016
      Replying to @OrinKerr

      @orinkerr @csoghoian @kimzetter Confused. Are you suggesting that the warrant req for stingrays is setting the bar too high?

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    2. Orin Kerr‏Verified account @OrinKerr 28 Jan 2016
      Replying to @cfarivar

      @cfarivar @csoghoian @KimZetter No. I'm assuming warrant req'd, but wondering how it could be constitutionally drafted. (1)

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    3. Cyrus Farivar‏Verified account @cfarivar 28 Jan 2016
      Replying to @OrinKerr

      @orinkerr @csoghoian @kimzetter Are you ok with WA state law on this? @ddrigmaiden helped with drafting. http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/05/cops-must-now-get-a-warrant-to-use-stingrays-in-washington-state/ …

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    4. Daniel Rigmaiden‏ @ddRigmaiden 28 Jan 2016
      Replying to @cfarivar

      @cfarivar @OrinKerr @csoghoian @KimZetter For one thing, phone itself is searched for the stored IMSI and that data is seized from phone.

      1 reply 1 retweet 1 like
    5. Orin Kerr‏Verified account @OrinKerr 28 Jan 2016
      Replying to @ddRigmaiden

      @ddRigmaiden @cfarivar @csoghoian @KimZetter So is the place "every phone in the general geographic area"? How can that pass the 4A test?

      3 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    6. Daniel Rigmaiden‏ @ddRigmaiden 28 Jan 2016
      Replying to @OrinKerr

      @OrinKerr @cfarivar @csoghoian 2. gov "contends that it would be impossible to describe the 'place' to be searched..." 468 U.S. 705, 718

      1 reply 1 retweet 1 like
    7. Orin Kerr‏Verified account @OrinKerr 28 Jan 2016
      Replying to @ddRigmaiden

      @ddRigmaiden @cfarivar @csoghoian Of course, but in Karo, there was a single place into which they placed the device. What is that here?

      3 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. Daniel Rigmaiden‏ @ddRigmaiden 28 Jan 2016
      Replying to @OrinKerr

      @OrinKerr @cfarivar @csoghoian Definitely multiple un-described devices searched and data seized from each device when using a StingRay.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. Orin Kerr‏Verified account @OrinKerr 28 Jan 2016
      Replying to @ddRigmaiden

      @ddRigmaiden @cfarivar @csoghoian What info does the officer actually see? Does he see records of every phone in area?

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    10. Daniel Rigmaiden‏ @ddRigmaiden 28 Jan 2016
      Replying to @OrinKerr

      @OrinKerr @cfarivar @csoghoian Yes. Unless the StingRay has technical barrier/filter to block human access to data seized from non-targets.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
      emptywheel‏ @emptywheel 28 Jan 2016
      Replying to @ddRigmaiden

      @ddRigmaiden You think they do? If so why is DOJ emphasis on deleting data between uses? @OrinKerr @cfarivar @csoghoian

      1:19 PM - 28 Jan 2016
      3 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Daniel Rigmaiden‏ @ddRigmaiden 28 Jan 2016
          Replying to @emptywheel

          @emptywheel @OrinKerr @cfarivar @csoghoian But a "filter," if defined by statute and implemented w/ transparency, could be a compromise. (2)

          4 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Orin Kerr‏Verified account @OrinKerr 28 Jan 2016
          Replying to @ddRigmaiden

          @ddRigmaiden @emptywheel @cfarivar @csoghoian I'm thinking about the 4th Amendment particularity issue, which isn't just a policy Q.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. Daniel Rigmaiden‏ @ddRigmaiden 28 Jan 2016
          Replying to @OrinKerr

          @OrinKerr @emptywheel @cfarivar Here's something I wrote about particularity vis-a-vis StingRay & stored data: http://freedomdujour.com/articles/201407251/suppress-stingray-cell-phone-tracking-evidence-arguing-stored-data-seizure …

          1 reply 1 retweet 5 likes
        5. Orin Kerr‏Verified account @OrinKerr 28 Jan 2016
          Replying to @ddRigmaiden

          @ddRigmaiden Thanks, helpful. What info does phone automatically send to connected cell tower?

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        6. Daniel Rigmaiden‏ @ddRigmaiden 28 Jan 2016
          Replying to @OrinKerr

          @OrinKerr After phone thinks its connected to a cell tower, lots of data is sent automatically. But cell tower broadcasts the 1st signal.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        7. Orin Kerr‏Verified account @OrinKerr 28 Jan 2016
          Replying to @ddRigmaiden

          @ddRigmaiden So if phone configured to auto send all this data to anyone who requests it, why is it a "search" of the phone to get it?

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        8. Daniel Rigmaiden‏ @ddRigmaiden 28 Jan 2016
          Replying to @OrinKerr

          @OrinKerr If it's, e.g., an AT&T phone it w/ only send to an FCC approved AT&T tower. Police impersonate AT&T, which is unreasonable.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        9. Orin Kerr‏Verified account @OrinKerr 28 Jan 2016
          Replying to @ddRigmaiden

          @ddRigmaiden Huh? Based on what cases?

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        10. 1 more reply
        1. Daniel Rigmaiden‏ @ddRigmaiden 28 Jan 2016
          Replying to @emptywheel

          @emptywheel @OrinKerr @cfarivar @csoghoian There are statutory "filters" in place for TIII wiretaps. E.g. stop listening for a little while.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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        1. Daniel Rigmaiden‏ @ddRigmaiden 28 Jan 2016
          Replying to @emptywheel

          @emptywheel @OrinKerr @cfarivar @csoghoian I think there is no actual "filter," precisely because DOJ emphasize deletion after use. (1)

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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