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emptywheel's profile
emptywheel
emptywheel
emptywheel
@emptywheel

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emptywheel

@emptywheel

Abundant tweets about civil liberties & national security. "Has a longer memory than an elephant & keeps more records than Jim Comey.” Legendary potty mouth.

Grand Rapids, MI
emptywheel.net
Joined August 2008

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    1. Jed Shugerman Vote 11/6‏ @jedshug Sep 15

      4/ I just have a phone on me, and this is an interesting question that probably isn’t going to play out (b/c of Manafort’s state crim liability). Thoughts? @Mimirocah1 @danielsgoldman @Delavegalaw @CBHessick @nycsouthpaw @AshaRangappa_ @BarbMcQuade @JoyceWhiteVance @emptywheel

      7 replies 30 retweets 116 likes
      Show this thread
    2. Mimi Rocah‏Verified account @Mimirocah1 Sep 15
      Replying to @jedshug @danielsgoldman and

      Agree with what you’ve said. If I understand your remaining question - can’t get immunity for lying to the court.

      1 reply 12 retweets 110 likes
    3. Jed Shugerman Vote 11/6‏ @jedshug Sep 15
      Replying to @Mimirocah1 @danielsgoldman and

      But that still leaves open a question: he claims his court testimony is true. Would an immunity deal immunize him for obstruction based on contradicting his proffer?

      7 replies 12 retweets 65 likes
    4. Randall Eliason‏ @RDEliason Sep 15
      Replying to @jedshug @Mimirocah1 and

      Immunity grants don’t protect you from perjury or obstruction charges if you lie while giving immunized testimony. But as @EricColumbus points out, what would stop Trump from then pardoning Manafort for perjury or obstruction?

      5 replies 4 retweets 33 likes
    5. emptywheel‏ @emptywheel Sep 15
      Replying to @RDEliason @jedshug and

      As I argue here, I think you first have to figure out what Manafort took such a hellacious plea deal. https://www.emptywheel.net/2018/09/14/the-objection-that-made-muellers-case/ … I strongly suspect part of that it he came to believe what comes next won't be pardonable.

      2 replies 9 retweets 50 likes
    6. Randall Eliason‏ @RDEliason Sep 15
      Replying to @emptywheel @jedshug and

      It’s actually a good deal for him, not hellacious at all. See my other reply.

      1 reply 1 retweet 14 likes
    7. emptywheel‏ @emptywheel Sep 15
      Replying to @RDEliason @jedshug and

      I saw it. You're saying 2 years and zero money is better than 2 years and $16M. That ... doesn't seem like a good deal to me.

      3 replies 0 retweets 14 likes
    8. Daniel S. Goldman‏Verified account @danielsgoldman Sep 15
      Replying to @emptywheel @RDEliason and

      You’re assuming a pardon is a sure thing. PM doesn’t control a pardon. He does control whether he cooperates or not. Would you trust Trump to be loyal to you, particularly when it would come with such a steep political cost for Trump and financial cost for you (lawyers fees)?

      2 replies 3 retweets 32 likes
    9. emptywheel‏ @emptywheel Sep 15
      Replying to @danielsgoldman @RDEliason and

      No, I'm not. Your argument is entirely premised on Manafort having done actions that he didn't do for the last year. If Manafort were looking at basic math, he would have cooperated last November.

      3 replies 0 retweets 18 likes
    10. larry israel‏ @larryisrael2 Sep 15
      Replying to @emptywheel @danielsgoldman and

      What if Trump told him he couldn’t pardon him until he was leaving office. Perhaps Manafort realized the pardon was too much of a risk if he hadn’t got it yet

      1 reply 0 retweets 15 likes
      emptywheel‏ @emptywheel Sep 15
      Replying to @larryisrael2 @danielsgoldman and

      I agree that's part of it. BUt why was it a bigger risk on September 10, 2018 than it was in October 27, 2017?

      2:53 PM - 15 Sep 2018
      • 13 Likes
      • Themistocles' Wall RussellOtway Pink Tsunami 2018 busticated BingoBango 𝒱𝑒𝓍_𝒪𝒹𝑜𝓃𝒾𝓈 Patrick H. Hoy Joyce Welu Johnson ((( Russian Bad Boy Bot )))
      2 replies 0 retweets 13 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. larry israel‏ @larryisrael2 Sep 15
          Replying to @emptywheel @danielsgoldman and

          He has been in jail awhile. I think that reality has an effect. I also believe there were family members who potentially had exposure.

          1 reply 0 retweets 21 likes
        3. emptywheel‏ @emptywheel Sep 15
          Replying to @larryisrael2 @danielsgoldman and

          Both reasonable explanations, thanks.

          1 reply 0 retweets 17 likes
        4. larry israel‏ @larryisrael2 Sep 15
          Replying to @emptywheel @danielsgoldman and

          Thank you!

          1 reply 0 retweets 8 likes
        5. Eric Columbus‏Verified account @EricColumbus Sep 15
          Replying to @larryisrael2 @emptywheel and

          Who in M’s family had exposure?

          2 replies 0 retweets 5 likes
        6. emptywheel‏ @emptywheel Sep 15
          Replying to @EricColumbus @larryisrael2 and

          His wife. BUt if they were going to charge her they would have done so a year ago. Downing did say the plea was partly abt keeping them safe.

          2 replies 4 retweets 20 likes
        7. Eric Columbus‏Verified account @EricColumbus Sep 15
          Replying to @emptywheel @larryisrael2 and

          Yeah was wondering about that. Downing said M pleaded because he “wanted to make sure that his family was able to remain safe and live a good life.” BS or meaningful?

          6 replies 4 retweets 32 likes
        8. Jed Shugerman Vote 11/6‏ @jedshug Sep 15
          Replying to @EricColumbus @emptywheel and

          I think very meaningful. Feds surely offered protection. How many Russian expats have been poisoned? Maybe paranoid, but reasonable paranoia, if you will.

          3 replies 6 retweets 47 likes
        9. Eric Columbus‏Verified account @EricColumbus Sep 15
          Replying to @jedshug @emptywheel and

          As long as Manafort wasn’t cooperating, why would he think his family was in danger?

          15 replies 2 retweets 9 likes
        10. 5 more replies
        1. Aneela Mirchandani‏ @TheOddPantry Sep 15
          Replying to @emptywheel @larryisrael2 and

          Also possible he expected the pardon to be imminent after conviction. None came instead they gave him promises.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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