You don't think a large number of IC professionals think of our information operations as different than Russia's? Or even our hacking?
-
-
Replying to @emptywheel @sfmnemonic and
You don't think it's different, at all? I may be a hypocrite, but I do believe it is different, when a "civilized", democratic country *) does it, vs. a backward dictatorship. *) the distinction may be moot point in a year or two, true.
1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes -
Replying to @TrollMcTrollski @sfmnemonic and
I believe there is a difference in kind and use, more applicable to China than Russia. I believe the US plays games with distinctions between public/private/contractor/managed criminal that are ultimately just that, games.
1 reply 0 retweets 1 like -
Replying to @emptywheel @TrollMcTrollski and
But I think anytime anyone is justifying one's behavior by invoking "civilization," it's a surefire, century's old sign they're dodging.
1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes -
Replying to @emptywheel @sfmnemonic and
Yes, and one may convincingly argue that it contributed to this country's ongoing slide into not-so-civilized-after-all. But let me narrow it down. It's the presence of democratic oversight and accountability (however imperfect!) that constitutes the crucial difference for me.
2 replies 0 retweets 1 like -
Replying to @TrollMcTrollski @emptywheel and
There's a chance, even if it's slim, of somebody like, say, you bringing up attention to the govt. doing these things, actually resulting in policy reversals, legislative efforts, etc. In places like China and Russia they can do it on arbitrary whims; w/ no accountability.
1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes -
Replying to @TrollMcTrollski @sfmnemonic and
I'd say that's a fair distinction between internal use. That is, RU can and does hack its own citizens in problematic ways (including to collect evidence to kill them). 1/2
1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes -
Replying to @emptywheel @TrollMcTrollski and
But Jack's piece is abt international use. That's a harder distinction to make. Especially since most of our hacking/info ops v Russia is done under EO 12333, where there's only limited Congressional oversight.
2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes -
Replying to @emptywheel @sfmnemonic and
I was actually thinking international ops; but a) yes, I assumed (being naive?) that there had been some changes/there was some degree of society control/a possibility of such 2) I was thinking of it in broader terms - not just cyber, but invasions/bombings/drone attacks 1/2
1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes -
Replying to @TrollMcTrollski @emptywheel and
But don't get me wrong - I'm not 100% positive I'm NOT a big fat hypocrite; thinking that when our airforce bombs a hospital it's better than when RU does it; just because there may be a congressional hearing and some general [sometimes] ends up going into an early retirement 2/2
1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
Snowden only really affected our drone activities by making it harder for other countries to cooperate. And our accountability on bombing MSF, such as it is (no Generals retired), also needs to account for our enabling of Saudi Arabia, not exactly a democracy.
-
-
Replying to @emptywheel @sfmnemonic and
To clarify, the last 2 tweets were not specific to Snowden. I was explaining my earlier one, "democratic oversight is what makes us different". I had that illusion (?) in 2008, that I was witnessing just that. GWB got us into a terrible war, the society realized it and elected...
1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
End of conversation
New conversation -
Loading seems to be taking a while.
Twitter may be over capacity or experiencing a momentary hiccup. Try again or visit Twitter Status for more information.