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emptywheel's profile
emptywheel
emptywheel
emptywheel
@emptywheel

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emptywheel

@emptywheel

Abundant tweets about civil liberties & national security. "Has a longer memory than an elephant & keeps more records than Jim Comey.” Legendary potty mouth.

Grand Rapids, MI
emptywheel.net
Joined August 2008

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    1. emptywheel‏ @emptywheel Jun 13

      A lot of normally smart people seem to be missing this: Trump pardoning Cohen would be the stupidest possible thing Trump could do. That's bc: 1) Up until seating of jury in federal trial, Cohen's presumed charges could be refiled in NYS, where Trump couldn't pardon.

      16 replies 97 retweets 223 likes
      Show this thread
    2. emptywheel‏ @emptywheel Jun 13

      2) If Trump pardons Cohen then he can be forced to testify against Trump. So if you're arguing that today's reports are signaling to Trump, it's more likely a request for help paying lawyers, not a pardon.

      13 replies 61 retweets 178 likes
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      emptywheel‏ @emptywheel Jun 13

      Now, Trump being Trump, it's certainly possible he's too stupid to know that pardoning Cohen will actually hurt him. But Cohen probably knows at least enough about the law to know it'd be counterproductive now.

      12:48 PM - 13 Jun 2018
      • 28 Retweets
      • 147 Likes
      • catherineonpaper Lt.Cmdr Dr.Tw1t3r_J3$u$, PI, DDS, Esq the III NikiAquarius Tina Kaye sherna foucher Gov't Mule Jack of Shadows Jana🗽⚖I believe Dr. Ford⚖🗽 Kenneth Sholl
      12 replies 28 retweets 147 likes
        1. Lean D‏ @lucciinthesky Jun 13
          Replying to @emptywheel

          If Trump pardoned Cohen, and then Cohen refused to testify, and Cohen was found in contempt, can Trump pardon him a second time?

          0 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
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        1. SecretSquirrel‏ @sparks_randi Jun 13
          Replying to @emptywheel

          Accepting a pardon requires you to admit guilt & testify fully!

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
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        1. Kelly‏ @jerryphelps Jun 13
          Replying to @emptywheel

          shhhhhh

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
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        1. New conversation
        2. Scott Rome‏ @Scott_H_Rome Jun 13
          Replying to @emptywheel

          I never understood this about pardoning hurting him. What would compel Cohen to tell the truth or cooperate after the pardon (Other than state charges that is)

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        3. Andrew Long‏ @andrewlong166 Jun 13
          Replying to @Scott_H_Rome @emptywheel

          He still testifies under penalty of perjury.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. Sandra Damiana Silverwitch Swan‏ @damianaswan Jun 13
          Replying to @andrewlong166 @Scott_H_Rome @emptywheel

          And Trump cannot proactively pardon him, for perjury or anything else.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        5. Andrew Long‏ @andrewlong166 Jun 13
          Replying to @damianaswan @Scott_H_Rome @emptywheel

          Honestly I'm not sure about that. There are timing issues, as Marcy notes in thread, but Ford proactively pardoned Nixon, and that stuck.

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        6. Scott Rome‏ @Scott_H_Rome Jun 13
          Replying to @andrewlong166 @damianaswan @emptywheel

          and why would it have to be a pardon in advance? So he testifies under penalty of perjury and then just could be pardoned again if he perjures himself. Once Trump is in pardon territory with Cohen what's his blowback for pardoning him twice?

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        7. 1 more reply
        1. Jack of Shadows‏ @Gladius8472 Jun 14
          Replying to @emptywheel

          Yes. Trump’s too stupid to know that pardoning Cohen would be a bad idea.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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        1. Exen with the Big Dork Energy‏ @exentrik137 Jun 13
          Replying to @emptywheel

          I don't think he has any options left to him besides stupid ones.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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        1. New conversation
        2. Brucie Bat Mob Rosch‏ @brucierosch Jun 13
          Replying to @emptywheel

          Surely they have a dead letter drop.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Jack of Shadows‏ @Gladius8472 Jun 14
          Replying to @brucierosch @emptywheel

          Oh hush now.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. End of conversation
        1. Bob‏ @trebuchet_guy Jun 13
          Replying to @emptywheel

          I think Cohen's only response to a pardon from DJT would be "no thanks." Every other path likely results in a much lengthier jail term. Certainly more jeopardy.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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        1. Andrew‏ @mfmise Jun 13
          Replying to @emptywheel

          Trump certainly has enough sophistication to know that he can't outright fire Mueller (hence the discrediting) - so I suspect he will be attempting to use pardons strategically as he has done thus far.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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        1. GWLaw‏ @pgh_law Jun 13
          Replying to @emptywheel

          Keep in mind that good arguments exist that a self-interested Pardon of Cohen by Trump is itself unconstitutional and hence would not preclude Federal prosecution. For sure, Mueller and SDNY know this, and might litigate now if Trump pardons Cohen.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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        1. Jerry Newmark‏ @jerryn13 Jun 13
          Replying to @emptywheel

          Given what we know about Cohen's lawyering, I'd go with "possibly" rather than "probably".

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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