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eigenrobot's profile
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masquerobot

@eigenrobot

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    1.  🤖 Sonya Mann  🎀‏Verified account @sonyaellenmann Feb 28
      Replying to @WAWilsonIV

      Yeah, I still think it's true, although I'd assign lower certainty. (And my certainty in the first place isn't 100%.) But that's not the totality of my reasoning, I also have libertarian-ish deontological concerns. (I didn't get into that aspect with @arjunxkapoor.) Basically...

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    2.  🤖 Sonya Mann  🎀‏Verified account @sonyaellenmann Feb 28
      Replying to @sonyaellenmann @WAWilsonIV

      ...you can't obtain a child's consent for creating it, and I think that's fucked up, to bring someone into existence without their permission, especially since you're risking subjecting them to schizophrenia or chronic autoimmune pain or any of the other horrible conditions

      1 reply 1 retweet 5 likes
    3. Daniel Klein‏ @othercriteria Feb 28
      Replying to @sonyaellenmann @WAWilsonIV

      I think @The_Lagrangian has noted cloning yourself is a workaround to this objection.

      2 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
    4.  🤖 Sonya Mann  🎀‏Verified account @sonyaellenmann Feb 28
      Replying to @othercriteria @WAWilsonIV @The_Lagrangian

      That is a really interesting point. I guess you'd know whether you'd want to be cloned? Hmm

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. masquerobot‏ @eigenrobot Feb 28
      Replying to @sonyaellenmann @othercriteria and

      Hmmm accept that arguendo, then spose you have two potential parents who are quite happy with their lives Does this also work around AN?

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    6.  🤖 Sonya Mann  🎀‏Verified account @sonyaellenmann Feb 28
      Replying to @eigenrobot @othercriteria and

      IMO no, the results are too unpredictable

      2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
      masquerobot‏ @eigenrobot Feb 28
      Replying to @sonyaellenmann @othercriteria and

      So maybe the issue is reduced to propensity to suffer *in expectation,* and your threshold for ethical reproduction is just relatively high? (??)

      11:53 AM - 28 Feb 2018
      • 2 Likes
      • 🤖 Sonya Mann 🎀 Daniel Klein
      3 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
        1. New conversation
        2.  🤖 Sonya Mann  🎀‏Verified account @sonyaellenmann Feb 28
          Replying to @eigenrobot @othercriteria and

          Yesssss but it's a combination, the deontological side (put simply, it violates the NAP to create life) is also important to me

          2 replies 0 retweets 5 likes
        3. ЬᏂ​au​ϮᏂ‏ @peroxycarbonate Feb 28
          Replying to @sonyaellenmann @eigenrobot and

          What do you get if you combine the ethics of Sonya here and Robin Hanson? Gamma radiation?

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        4. masquerobot‏ @eigenrobot Feb 28
          Replying to @peroxycarbonate @sonyaellenmann and

          heh I think Robin Hanson is at odds with Sonya actually http://www.overcomingbias.com/2009/12/shoo-libertarian-trolls.html …

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        5. ЬᏂ​au​ϮᏂ‏ @peroxycarbonate Feb 28
          Replying to @eigenrobot @sonyaellenmann and

          Yes, Robin Hanson thinks it'd be Extremely Good to have trillions of emulated humans working in slave-like conditions, because the marginal value of each is still positive. The joke is that his ethics and Sonya's have a physical reaction like antimatter and matter.

          0 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
        6. End of conversation
        1. New conversation
        2. Adam Strandberg‏ @The_Lagrangian Feb 28
          Replying to @eigenrobot @sonyaellenmann and

          <taleb voice> imbecile, it's about the tail risk, not the expected value

          1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
        3.  🤖 Sonya Mann  🎀‏Verified account @sonyaellenmann Feb 28
          Replying to @The_Lagrangian @eigenrobot and

          now that you put it that way, Mr. Taleb... actually yeah

          1 reply 1 retweet 2 likes
        4. Adam Strandberg‏ @The_Lagrangian Feb 28
          Replying to @sonyaellenmann @eigenrobot and

          the extension to that is that the objection to being born mostly goes away if you can get genuinely costfree exit- bound losses while exposing to upside

          1 reply 1 retweet 3 likes
        5. Daniel Klein‏ @othercriteria Feb 28
          Replying to @The_Lagrangian @sonyaellenmann and

          You also probably want your bound to be secret and random (with light tails?), to prevent gaming and blackmail.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        6. Adam Strandberg‏ @The_Lagrangian Feb 28
          Replying to @othercriteria @sonyaellenmann and

          you wouldn't have a sufferometer that kills you if you go above a certain level, you would just have the right to exercise your option as you saw fit- unclear how this makes you more exploitable than in current world

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        7. Daniel Klein‏ @othercriteria Feb 28
          Replying to @The_Lagrangian @sonyaellenmann and

          Free exit feels like keeping your steering wheel in Game of Chicken idk.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        8. Daniel Klein‏ @othercriteria Feb 28
          Replying to @othercriteria @The_Lagrangian and

          (And a "sufferometer" would be the most useful form of that for situations of partial incapacity, where exit is least free now...)

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        9. End of conversation
        1. Daniel Klein‏ @othercriteria Feb 28
          Replying to @eigenrobot @sonyaellenmann and

          (Total suffering observer-moments seems more important than average propensity over those observer-moments.)

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
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