Even there, discounting plant welfare, opportunity costs abound for wild animals forced off land It's pretty bleak I'm not optimistic about human ability to live without causing suffering, but we probably have an obligation to minimize it proximately and/or marginally
Other birds were used for cytological studies. This required brain slices; birds were obviously killed for this. However. The stain we used would bind to blood, so birds had to be exsanguinated.
-
-
The easiest way to do this was to let the bird's heart pump blood out wholesale, so we'd anaesthetize them then slice open their chest, making sure to sever the aorta. Probably painless, but we would go home and drink in the dark after this procedure.
-
Being personally unable to do this is not a reason to support a ban on it. Animal research is vital. I don't think anything but mortal terror could make me kill something with my own hands, but I'll be damned if I stop eating cheeseburgers.
-
I *was* able to do it, and did. I don't think it was justified. Benefits outside of "this lab continues to get grants" were zero.
-
If the research is vital, pay humans to participate. We're a better model for other humans anyway.
-
drug discovery strategies that involve testing thousands of variations of a compound can't be done using human subjects
End of conversation
New conversation -
-
-
The worst were cases--I can't remember why--when birds were killed with carbon dioxide. Carbon monoxide isn't a bad way to go, because it knocks you out as you suffocate. CO2, you're conscious and gasping for air the whole time. It takes ages and it's hard to watch.
Thanks. Twitter will use this to make your timeline better. UndoUndo
-
-
-
Anyway, I'm struggling to imagine a moral framework where causing this suffering was justified.
-
suffering only counts if it's people suffering, and we arbitrarily decide that homo sapiens are the only people
-
Heh fair point. I guess I discount that out of hand. I'm not sure the choice of utility weighting needs to be so start or arbitrary, though.
End of conversation
New conversation -
-
-
I'm more familiar with this sort of stuff with mice but yeah, I know.
Thanks. Twitter will use this to make your timeline better. UndoUndo
-
Loading seems to be taking a while.
Twitter may be over capacity or experiencing a momentary hiccup. Try again or visit Twitter Status for more information.