You'd have to be a bit more specific for me to know what I think of that. Who do you mean by women and what kind of boundaries are you referring to?
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Replying to @e_urq
Grown_UpWoman Retweeted Grown_UpWoman
Look through this thread:https://mobile.twitter.com/wendycockcroft/status/1290651269619744771 …
Grown_UpWoman added,
Grown_UpWoman @Grown_UpWomanReplying to @TgeigsFirst we need to agree on what that phrase means. I believe trans rights are human rights and ought to be enshrined in law and upheld at all times. The trouble is, some people are confused as to what those rights are -- and ought to be. Tautologies don't work in real life.1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes -
Replying to @Grown_UpWoman
Great, so it seems like I was right in thinking it has something to do with women only spaces, and that by women (in that context) you mean natal women? Natal women being allowed to do a specific thing, which is exclude trans women from certain spaces? Any corrections to that?
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Replying to @e_urq
All of that, Evan. Bear in mind that trans is a big umbrella term. https://www.stonewall.org.uk/what-does-trans-mean … If you read the pinned thread in my profile you'll see I started out being quite naive about it until I looked into it and... whoa! Seriously?pic.twitter.com/WwGTisrCY8
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Replying to @Grown_UpWoman
Big umbrella term, yep, saw that part. I'll have a look at the pinned thread- it'll take a minute because I'm on tweetdeck so I'll have to go find you on twitter proper, but I want to take in as much context as necessary before blowing you away with my unimpeachable logic (lol).
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Replying to @e_urq
Looking forward to it. I've got bookmarks and am not afraid to use them.
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Replying to @Grown_UpWoman
Am I right in thinking that by transsexual you mean someone who has had genital surgery? Maybe someone who both passes and has genital surgery, but not someone who passes and hasn't had genital surgery? But, genital surgery is crucial- I'm not getting that wrong?
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Replying to @e_urq
There's usually some kind of meaningful transition and attempt to actually live as the opposite sex. Not all of them have bottom surgery; that was the thing I was naive about. I'm fine with the ones who at least attempt to pass as female but some just take the everlasting mickey
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Replying to @Grown_UpWoman
Hmm. OK, I'm glad I asked for clarification. I'm not sure we have as much disagreement as I thought. Are you saying that trans women should be treated as women except in rare cases where they are so gender nonconforming as to be visually indistinguishable from men?
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Replying to @e_urq
I don't agree 100% but it does seem like a pretty small corner of the issue and maybe not worth disputing too strongly. It also sounds like you think passing is pretty important, maybe more important than genitals, which makes my standard thought experiment less relevant.
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My standard thought experiment (to lay cards on the table), being whether trans men should be allowed total access to women only spaces, regardless of how uncomfortable they make women, and how to stop cis men from pretending to be trans men.
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Replying to @e_urq
That's it, right there. While celebrated trans man Buck Angel would be welcomed by radfems for being born female, I'd be uncomfortable because he presents as a man. You actually have to be told he was born female, you wouldn't believe it if you saw him on one of his videos.
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