Neither Gandalf nor the Elf lords were omniscient or infallible. All of them made major mistakes regarding various matters. Also, Saruman was more powerful than all of them, at least until Gandalf leveled up. He was definitely older than all but Gandalf...
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Replying to @legalinspire @danlistensto and
... and arguably more knowledgeable than any of them. (Gandalf says specifically that Saruman has been studying ring-lore.) Does it matter how many people think one thing if someone who knows better thinks another?
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well, we're talking ex-post facto here so we already know that in this particular case, yes it did matter and Saruman should have accepted the consensus on the ring. he was arrogant and believed himself superior enough to succeed where others had failed. he was wrong.
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Replying to @danlistensto @legalinspire and
in general is it irrational to break with consensus? that depends on how the consensus was formed. if it's just a social norm then it's not irrational. if it's based on the best available evidence then yes it is irrational to break with it unless you have new evidence.
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There was *no* available evidence for what would happen if Saruman got hold of the ring. Gandalf and the Elflords had one theory: Saruman had another. We will never know which was correct. I suspect Saruman *was* wrong, inasumch as a fictional character can be "wrong."
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we absolutely have evidence. we know that the rings rapidly corrupt any mortals and that all 9 of the human kings and all 7 of the dwarf lords became corrupted this way. we also know that the other 3 Wizards became corrupted by various means (if not necessarily rings of power).
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Saruman is not mortal. Sauruman is stronger and arguably smarter than the other wizards.
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well he seemed to think so but it turns out not so much
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Whether a person is shown to be incorrect about something after the fact has zero bearing on whether they are smarter than somebody who was not. And he was the strongest, as I said, until Gandalf leveled up. Which the Valar arguably did for the purpose of dealing with Saruman.
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(Side note: I've really enjoyed this conversation, even when we didn't agree. I hope everyone else has too, and no one is suffering from nerd rage.)
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agree completely. nerding out makes me happy.
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