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cmuratori's profile
Casey Muratori
Casey Muratori
Casey Muratori
@cmuratori

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Casey Muratori

@cmuratori

I'm worried that the baby thinks people can't change.

Seattle
caseymuratori.com
Joined March 2009

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    1. tahini‏ @tahini Jan 18
      Replying to @Jonathan_Blow

      I honestly haven't read too many justifications (that's partly what spawned this question in my mind). I remember a time when there was ctags in Vim for this kind of stuff. The LSP paradigm, for me, feels easier. But I am curious if I am missing something?

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    2. tahini‏ @tahini Jan 18
      Replying to @tahini @Jonathan_Blow

      Put another way, when I think 'bloated and slow', I typically think of an actual IDE.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. Jonathan Blow‏ @Jonathan_Blow Jan 18
      Replying to @tahini

      Okay, so, how is it that an actual IDE gets 'bloated and slow'?

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    4. tahini‏ @tahini Jan 18
      Replying to @Jonathan_Blow

      Continual expansion of features, driven by monetization. Complexity, basically.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. Jonathan Blow‏ @Jonathan_Blow Jan 18
      Replying to @tahini

      Really? Does Visual Studio of today have a lot more features than Visual Studio did in 2005?

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    6. Jonathan Blow‏ @Jonathan_Blow Jan 18
      Replying to @Jonathan_Blow @tahini

      Like enough features to compensate for Moore's Law? Like 100x as many features?

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    7. tahini‏ @tahini Jan 18
      Replying to @Jonathan_Blow

      No, not 100x as many features. Not enough to compensate for Moore’s Law.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. tahini‏ @tahini Jan 18
      Replying to @tahini @Jonathan_Blow

      I get that programmers today are spoiled by processing power and that has made them inferior programmers when it comes to perf — I’m just trying to get at how fact that is particularly highlighted with LSP

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. Casey Muratori‏ @cmuratori Jan 18
      Replying to @tahini @Jonathan_Blow

      I think Jon was just hoping most programmers would know the rough cost delta between a direct call using a shared memory binary AST, and a socket-mediated RPC that requires serializing the data to and from UTF-8 both ways. LSP is just sad proof that they definitely don't.

      1 reply 0 retweets 6 likes
    10. tahini‏ @tahini Jan 18
      Replying to @cmuratori @Jonathan_Blow

      Was LSP implemented in manner that is performant? No, it doesn’t look like it. But it exists, and I think it’s popularity has to do with the lack of viable alternatives. If implicit suggestion here is to just use an IDE or ctags ... well many people don’t want this things.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Casey Muratori‏ @cmuratori Jan 18
      Replying to @tahini @Jonathan_Blow

      But this has nothing to do with IDEs. You can trivially design a similar AST interchange protocol that is in-memory, binary, and does not require sockets. The sadness (presumably) comes from the fact that nobody seemed to think that was an important consideration.

      6:31 PM - 18 Jan 2021
      • 5 Likes
      • γper ᜶ ᜀᜅ᜔ ᜉᜉᜇᜓᜈᜒ ᜶ Gustavo Knüppe Ivan Braidi tahini
      1 reply 0 retweets 5 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. tahini‏ @tahini Jan 18
          Replying to @cmuratori @Jonathan_Blow

          Ok this is what I was looking for. So there was a recognized need as an industry to come together to make some sort of AST standard like this, and the chosen implementation (out of presumably others) was bad.

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. tahini‏ @tahini Jan 18
          Replying to @tahini @cmuratori @Jonathan_Blow

          Does socket-based approach come with any advantages at all over the alternatives?

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. Show replies

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