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chaosprime's profile
Chaos
Chaos
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@chaosprime

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Chaos

@chaosprime

problemagic

Joined July 2012

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    1. Chaos‏ @chaosprime 4 Nov 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @lethargilistic

      there may be outlier cases i'm not aware of, but i've never personally known "tag and fix" to be used for copyvio that has been determined to be copyvio after inspection; you delete the offending material and notability doesn't enter into it

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    2. Shibbo Leth‏ @lethargilistic 4 Nov 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @chaosprime

      This is where I think we differ: I say that is a bad approach. Notability should come first, and the new editor should be given the chance to fix an issue with the article they want to contribute. The article's potential should be prioritized over its ignorant first edit.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. Chaos‏ @chaosprime 4 Nov 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @lethargilistic

      sure, and that's largely how it goes down. copyvio 1) potentially threatens the integrity of the whole project and 2) reflects zero damn effort from the contributor, though, so it's not handled the same way as an honest noob attempt

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    4. Shibbo Leth‏ @lethargilistic 4 Nov 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @chaosprime

      1) No it doesn't, as the worst thing that could happen is a takedown request that would be complied with anyway. 2) That is unnecessary hostility that leads to unnecessary haste. It should be treated like any other rule violation by a new editor.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. Chaos‏ @chaosprime 4 Nov 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @lethargilistic

      1) legal opinions vary 2) it's called a criterion for *speedy* deletion for a reason. anyway, these are things you can argue should be the way it's done, but they're *not* the way it's done, and it's not reasonable to expect the admin to suddenly have started doing it this way

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. Shibbo Leth‏ @lethargilistic 4 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @chaosprime

      1) They don't tho. One copyvio article existing for a day wouldn't threaten the project any more than 600 over 4 years. 2) I agree, but it was a bad end. It's important to point out why & how to improve. Arguing from "the way its done" gives undue weight to current bad practice.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. Chaos‏ @chaosprime 4 Nov 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @lethargilistic

      1) "other problems exist in an unsolved state" is not a very a good argument for "let's not solve this problem". 2) enh, Chesterton's Fence, but sure, if process can reasonably be made better, argue for it

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. Chaos‏ @chaosprime 4 Nov 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @chaosprime @lethargilistic

      but maybe probably don't start from a position of reading misogynist bias into process massively overdetermined by clear non-bias factors, because that's basically just a ginned up threat and that's a shitty way to deal with people

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. Chaos‏ @chaosprime 4 Nov 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @chaosprime @lethargilistic

      which is not to say that asking "are there feasible ways we could tweak process to avoid creating the *appearance* of bias that some people perceived in this situation?" is unreasonable

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    10. Shibbo Leth‏ @lethargilistic 4 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @chaosprime

      I would and do make the claim that it is used disproportionately and "speedier" against minority topics because, in my WP experience, that is overwhelmingly what WP rules lawyering results in. But talking general improvement is a more palatable approach.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Chaos‏ @chaosprime 4 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @lethargilistic

      okay. my experience was more that if you include two reliable source citations you'll be okay and if you don't you're straight up rolling the dice with very little in the way of roll modifiers, but idk. you participating in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Countering_systemic_bias …?

      9:47 PM - 4 Nov 2018
      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Shibbo Leth‏ @lethargilistic 4 Nov 2018
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @chaosprime

          Nope. I mostly roll through US Supreme Court articles and copyright-related stuff and run into a bunch of peeps who use the rules as a stonewall for their opinions. But I used to edit Wookieepedia, so I was used to nonsense. Most people don't get it, and they shouldn't have to.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Chaos‏ @chaosprime 4 Nov 2018
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @lethargilistic

          *nodnod* tendentious editing? in *my* Wikipedia? (it's more likely than you think!) i have a grudge against that Wikiproject because they didn't want to help me when people were trying to get the title Sephiroth to go to the goddamn Squenix character, but they might help you

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. End of conversation

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