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bgrant0607's profile
Brian Grant
Brian Grant
Brian Grant
@bgrant0607

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Brian Grant

@bgrant0607

Google Cloud. Kubernetes Steering Committee emeritus, K8s SIG Architecture co-Chair emeritus, CNCF TOC member emeritus

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github.com/bgrant0607
Joined June 2014

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    1. Joe Beda‏Verified account @jbeda 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @jbeda @stephenaugustus and

      I think I proposed the shared network namespace and ip per pod along with the per container filesystem/chroot. It might have been Tim though. Lots of bikeshedding to come up with the name Pod.

      1 reply 1 retweet 16 likes
    2. Joe Beda‏Verified account @jbeda 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @jbeda @stephenaugustus and

      Originally we got a ton of pushback on it as people didn't get it. Had to hack it into docker with pause container. It was only after there were common sidecars that it clicked for folks. Docker issue from 2014 is still open.https://github.com/moby/moby/issues/8781 …

      2 replies 2 retweets 43 likes
    3. Tim Hockin‏ @thockin 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @jbeda @stephenaugustus and

      Borg "alloc" -> Omega "scheduling unit" -> Kubernetes "pod". The name itself was from a brainstorm. Docker's logo is a whale. A group of whales is called a ... Also, it was short. The network model was explored in Borg a few years prior, but wasn't feasible at the time.

      8 replies 41 retweets 192 likes
    4. wear a mask 雷启理‏ @littleidea 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @thockin @jbeda and

      Anyone know when alloc was born? Was this capability an epiphany or an accretion? If this isn’t lost to history, I would love to do the archeology.

      4 replies 2 retweets 7 likes
    5. Joe Beda‏Verified account @jbeda 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @littleidea @thockin and

      The borg folks would know better but here is my guess -- alloc was originally there to create a kind of "mini personal borg" that you could schedule into. It was a bit of a recursive concept. You could create the alloc to set aside space and then schedule into it later.

      3 replies 0 retweets 8 likes
    6. Joe Beda‏Verified account @jbeda 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @jbeda @littleidea and

      But the usage was evolved was that folks would put coupled pairs of services in there. The canonical examples were a log saver and a server or a search server and a search data loader. You could use constraints to ensure that one of each ended up in each alloc.

      2 replies 0 retweets 6 likes
    7. Joe Beda‏Verified account @jbeda 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @jbeda @littleidea and

      But the behavior here was somewhat confusing. Allocs were indexed (similar to k8s StatefulSets) and the things that scheduled into them were indexed too. Because there was this recursive scheduling system it woldn't line up.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    8. Joe Beda‏Verified account @jbeda 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @jbeda @littleidea and

      Specifically: alloc #3 might have logsaver #10 and server #8. IIRC this could cause problems when doing rolling upgrades. Over time this pairing pattern was the dominate use of alloc and provisions were made so that all of the indexes lined up cleanly.

      2 replies 0 retweets 5 likes
    9. Joe Beda‏Verified account @jbeda 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @jbeda @littleidea and

      Pod skilled that "sub allocation" capability and instead went strait to a clearer concept of having explicitly co-located resources.

      2 replies 0 retweets 5 likes
    10. Joe Beda‏Verified account @jbeda 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @jbeda @littleidea and

      Another thing -- at the time Borg generally didn't use linux namespaces. As such the network was shared across the node, not across the alloc/container. Ports were assigned to containers and they were kept honest about which ports they were allowed to use.

      2 replies 1 retweet 7 likes
      Brian Grant‏ @bgrant0607 7 Nov 2018
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      Replying to @jbeda @littleidea and

      Yes, dynamic port allocation had pervasive impact, on scheduling, configuration, discovery, monitoring, health checking, load balancing, various proxies, authentication, network isolation, and probably other things.

      8:58 PM - 7 Nov 2018
      • 8 Likes
      • z0id Jesse Nelson Tunde R.B. Boyer Janet Kuo 👩🏻‍💻 ⚑😀 4A4D42 😀⚑ Joe Beda JJ
      1 reply 0 retweets 8 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. ⚑ 😀 4A4D42  😀⚑‏ @josebiro 7 Nov 2018
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          Replying to @bgrant0607 @jbeda and

          This is the general pattern though, and I'm waiting for it to hit k8s. You start out by keeping a port map (google did the same), and at some point hit a wall that you can't maintain that list anymore and need something more dynamic.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. ⚑ 😀 4A4D42  😀⚑‏ @josebiro 7 Nov 2018
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          Replying to @josebiro @bgrant0607 and

          Dynamic ports changed everything because they were a massive shift from the way systems were designed up until that point. To be fair, most systems don't require that sort of scale still. However maintaining that list is still a PITA and should be offloaded to the scheduler.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
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