@bascule FP people have tons of ways to model mutable state. They don't like it as the natural case because of how complex it is.
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@KirinDave users of mutable state languages can likewise model immutable state. That said, it'd be nice to have more language-level support -
@bascule Having mutable as the default is where concurrency becomes totally insane. So it's not clear why mutability-by-default is great. -
@KirinDave I'd prefer a capability-based model where you have mutable and immutable views of the same data -
@bascule Like Clojure's refs and atoms? -
@KirinDave I'm not sure you understand what I mean by "capability". I'm coming from a capability-based security perspective -
@bascule Making the semantics of the value cell explicit and its interactions labeled? -
@KirinDave I think degradation is the central idea behind capabilities - 8 more replies
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@bascule#fsharp supports mutable data, but you have to explicitly declare it so.#strangeloop -
@SirEel seems good
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@bascule Clojure has support for transient (mutable) types too for performance -
@strangeloop_stl I will have to ask@richhickey how often he thinks they should be used ;)
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@bascule I mean, "safe" ways to manage mutable state are incredibly numerous, from cell-based STM to ST-monad and everything in between.Thanks. Twitter will use this to make your timeline better. UndoUndo
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@bascule its useful too, especially if you want to lower your level of abstraction, but 90 to 99 % of the cases, it's not needed.Thanks. Twitter will use this to make your timeline better. UndoUndo
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